Need suggestions on bookshelf speaker upgrades

There is plenty of info on the forums.

Hi Ctsooner,
If you talk badly about any product and brand, you need to show evidences to support your claim. Who were those 4 people? What is the name of store?, What music was playing? What brand and model amps did you use? You mentioned "tried variety of amps, including tubes."

The wavetouch has the Heil air motion mid/tweeter that in past generations has been very fatiguing for many people.

Why do you talk about past when you've heard it. That sounds like you are not truthful. Also, Wavetouch speaker doesn't sound fatiguing. Never! That's where your statement is not credible.

What color horns were on Wavetouch speakers? Tweeter and woofer color? If you spent time like that, you will remember the color of horns. My horn colors are hard to forget. I can find who the owner of speaker is.

Alex/Wavetouch Audio

Alex, I'm truly sorry that I've upset you. I can understand why as you love your product and have passion for it. That's a great thing and something that is missing in society as a whole. I'm sorry that I haven't responded sooner, but I'm traveling for a few weeks and I don't have access daily to a computer and when I do, I'm not always on this site.

I've been posting on various forums for many years and I try not to get into pissing contests since I wouldn't do that in person. Audio is all about opinions and everyone's hearing is completely different. I have found most speakers to be fatiguing after awhile. I have never heard a speaker sound as good in a dealer as I have properly set up in a home. You're an engineer (I'm assuming) and I bet you'd say that is usually the case. I'm human and have prejudices that will most probably affect my thoughts on various components when auditioning or just listening. I HATED a pair of Legacy speakers in a particular store. They were the last gen model. I then heard a pair of newer ones and thought they sounded really nice, but to me, they were still not as good as another pair that costs less. I only mention dealers who are excellent and care. I would also mention a dealer who wasn't good or was rude. I visit many dealers around the world as I travel a lot and I love live music and audio, in that order.

I also have MS and that does affect my short term memory at times. I write down my thoughts on various products, but not all. I will not answer your questions for many reasons, but the biggest reason is that you insinuate that I'm not truthful. By saying NEVER sounding fatiguing, that's not a true statement as any speaker can sound fatiguing to certain people. I have heard people call the Vandy's faguging and I've never heard them that way, even in past generations when I wouldn't never have bought them. There is a reason that there are so many speaker companies around and so many have failed over the years. It's because everyone of us hears differently. I don't know much about your speakers and when set up properly, I'm sure they are wonderful, but I didn't hear them that way.

As for talking about the past, I do that with any speaker I've heard in the past as well as recently. I do that with Proacs and Vandy's too and I have or will own them. To most it's not a big deal as we all know we hear differently. I always tell people to go listen at a dealer they like and trust so they can hear things for themselves. I have found a bunch of guys I like and trust, but Johnny at Audio Connection stands out and I really like his product selection. That's me. I bet there are plenty of audiophiles who have gone into his store and purchased elsewhere for whatever reason. Again, not a big deal.

By reading most of my posts on this board, you can probably figure out that I will speak about fatigue, if a speaker gets out of it's own way, coherency, musicality etc... There are a few things that stand out to me about speakers and I've yet to hear one that does everything great and that includes speakers that I own ,have owned or am going to own. I don't remember the name of most of the people I meet. That includes store owners, unless I purchase from them. There are a few people on this forum who know me personally and know that I'm a good guy and I don't try to hurt people intentionally. I am sorry that I hurt your feelings, but I'm allowed to have an opinion just like anyone else. If anyone just takes any posters word on a product without listening at a dealer themselves, then they are doing themselves a disservice. Since becoming an audiophile in 1971 or so, I've met many in the industry from dealers to reviewers to owners of companies. Tons of the bigger names in audio. I have had many discussions with them and have even called out reviewers to their faces for the games that are played in this industry. Again, people need to listen for themselves and make their own decisions.

I have not made any personal attacks against you or your company and as a retired Navy officer, my integrity is important to me. There are plenty of speakers I've listened to in the past year that I HATED and if the name gets brought up in a thread, I'll possibly share my feelings on them if I fully remember. Heck, I have heard the same Ayre amp that I recently purchased, sound average in a store. It's because they weren't using the balanced cables. I also didn't love any of the three speakers they ran it with, but one of the speakers I heard sounded better than it did at two other stores, so I gave the amp another listen at a dealer I'm now doing business with. This is a true story and I didn't mention the dealers as it doesn't matter to me. What matters are the components. When you said your speaker wasn't set up correctly, I agreed that you were probably correct. Again, I'm not cutting your speaker down at all.

I am not going to sit here and answer your specific questions as I wouldn't even remember the faces of any of the folks and that includes the guy who works at the store and I spent a lot of time with him. This is an open forum and you can attack my credibility all you want, but I'm not going to get into a pissing contest about my honesty. Alex, I really am sorry that I hurt your feelings as this is the first time I've ever not enjoyed audio. Now I really do want to hear your speakers in the proper set up. If I get that chance, I will give them a long listen and will share all thoughts as I will make many notes etc... Pete

Pete,
On March 21, you said "Maybe they weren't set up properly." I didn't say "set up is wrong." Don't you remember what you wrote? Now you saying

" When you said your speaker wasn't set up correctly, I agreed that you were probably correct. Again, I'm not cutting your speaker down at all."

You are sneaky and untruthful!

Again all you did is Vandy and AC advertising.

Pete, I don't need your excuse anymore. I and my speakers are doing fine. I don't have a time for this.

Alex
Wavetouch Audio

Wow, what a rude person and response. 90% or more of the
folks on here speak highly of their systems that they own or
are about to own. I guess I do the same. I also talk about
some products I hear along the way that I also like.
Sneaking and untruthful? Really? You can try and turn my
words into anything you want to. Bottom line is that when I
heard a pair of your speakers, they didn't do it for me. I
have no excuses for you Alex, nor would I or should I. I
put out an olive branch and you just stomped on it.

You obviously had plenty of time as you responded a few
times to my posts. How's that for using your words against
you? Sorry that my opinion doesn't count and yours does.
What a way to run a business Alex. I honestly don't
understand what your motive is other than to try and
discredit my thoughts by calling me a liar. You obviously
have no idea who I am. Since this is the first time I've
been called a liar in ages (don't remember another time
since I've been an adult)it took me off guard, lol.

I love and will always love music and the equipment it's
played on. What I don't' like are people who make any
product and tell everyone else that if you find anything
wrong with it, that you are wrong and a liar. Basically,
this thread is a microcosm of the world of audio. It's all
about personal preference and choices. That's why there are
SOOOO many speaker companies and why so many go out of
business after ten or so years.

Nearly everyone I've ever met who have heard my system or
Quicksilver with Proacs have loved them. They talk about
the speakers not being in the room. That said, not everyone
says that. I've heard two people say that the sound just
stays in between the speakers. Guess what Alex? Both are
correct because it's what they heard. How can you ever make
a statement that your speakers NEVER sound a certain way ( I
forget the exact words you used, so I won't put in the whole
phrase)? Never means for everyone regardless of their
hearing situation, the room (a room will play in part of
what anyone hears unless you are using headphones, right?),
etc....

Sorry, but you have just come off as a rude and angry man
and should probably have just accepted my apology and moved
on.

With all the time I've spent in this industry and with all
the people I've worked or associated myself with, you take
the cake with your responses. You have every right to think
what you want of me, but as Mom always said, if you don't
have something nice to say about someone, then don't say
anything....unless they come at you first. ;)

I really hope that you treat your paying customers better
than you treat strangers.