2. amps-preamps
  3. 1206198464

Why does it sound better at lower volumes?

Hi, I have a Krell, a Slim Devices Transporter, and Aerial 7B speakers with Zu spekaer and ICs. The thing is this combination sounds fantastic, among the best systems I've ever heard at lower even moderate volume levels. The Krell volume control is incremented from 0-150. Anything less than 50 sounds sounds fantastic across the frequency spectrum. But when I go higher on many pieces the highs take on on a harshness that is like an axe chopping broken glass.

Don't get me wrong - a number of pieces sound great - often classical and even some rock such as Fleetwood Mac sound great. I'm trying to figure out if many of the newer i.e., last 20 years, recordings with compression and boosted highs are the problem. Is my system just too good reproducing the dreck out of studios these days?

I've noticed in the car many of the same recordings sound ok with the background noise competing with the boosted highs. They boosted highs are still there but aren't as annoying due to the road noise and limitations of the car stereo.

I've just purchased a balanced cable - the Transporter has native XLR and it's often said Krell sounds noticeably better with XLR. It hasn't arrived yet.

Secondly, I'm thinking about a power conditioner. The guy at the Cable Co. said my system is just very detailed and probably needs power conditioning. Interestingly he wasn't pushing a cable at all.

I live in a new house but the power source isn't discrete. I can wire a discrete one but don't really want to go to the trouble. I have a discrete source in the crawlspace powering a single bulb down there and one outlet. I'm thinking about running an extension cable from that to my system just to try a discrete run to see if I should go further down that road.

Lastly I'm thinking about changing amps. Again is the Krell too good for my own good? :) I've heard a lot of amps from the big and small names and I like the Krell. It simply sounds fantastic... on probably 20% of my music. But I'm starting to think maybe I don't need that 20% like I need the other 80%. :) Maybe some coloration and rolling off of the highs is better at the end of the day.

I have a Sqeezebox as well and have A-B'ed it against my Rega Apollo. The Apollo was a little better but the SB did pretty well against it. I moved on up to the Transporter but haven't A-B'ed it against the Rega.

I've got to do something here, I guess other than listening at lower volumes. I may try a new integrated, say, a Plinius, MF, or go to tubes. Problem with tubes, my speakers aren't efficient so I'd need to eventually change speakers if I go that route. I have recently heard a Manley Stingray on Spendors and Quads and the sound did have that certain ineffable quality of warmth and a good sound. Also same with an SLI-80 and Theils. OTOH, I've heard my 7Bs sound fantastic on other systems such as Theta.

Any thoughts on this conundrum would appreciated. At 46 years old maybe it's just my ears acting their age.

regards, David
wireless200
shadorne's avatar
Ag insider logo xs@2x
shadorne
7,477 posts
 
Dave,

Instead of messing around with XLR cables - get a PEQ and just cut the mid range by about 6 db SPL from 1 to 5 Khz - that should do the trick to get rid of harshness, as this is the range where your hearing is the most sensitive to nasty distortion and loudness.

By the way, your speakers are probably very efficient - in which case your powerful Krell may be overdriving them into distortion due to exceeding their linear excursion range of the driver (at very high levels only of course). If I recall these speakers are often mated to lower power tube amps which would be less likely to cause this kind of extreme issue...
wireless200 OP
415 posts
 
Well I have to say I pretty much solved my problems with the highs. I tried most of the stuff suggested and went through two amps and finally bought a McIntosh MC402. I had really given up on all the stuff such as room conditioners, power conditioners, cables, etc., etc., etc. I was going to go retro and buy either a Mc integrated with tone controls or an Mc amp and preamp with tone controls. The heck with accuracy, I needed something I could sit and listen to.

Also considered various DACs - was about to buy a MF tri-vista tube Dac. Didn't really want to do that because I had a DAC (Transporter) already. Not many PEQs out there either.

So I was going to get the Mc with tone controls. I A-B'ed the integrateds against the separates. There was sizable difference in sound. So much so that I had to rule out the integrated (6900). They didn't have the MC7000 to listen to so no way was I going to buy one when the separates sounded so much better than the 6900.

So... I bought an MC402 with the idea that I would buy the preamp shortly thereafter. The MC402 weighed 180 lbs shipped and my wife thought I was crazy. After unpacking it I didn't have a lot of argument against her appraisal.

I went directly from my DAC to the amp. It sounds great! I found myself sitting there listening for long periods of time and liking CDs all the way through. This is as close as I've come to analog since I left it in the early 90s. The Mc is musical. I could write more about it but I'll hold off for now.

I've kinda put the pre-amp on hold as was kinda afraid to touch anything. You know how we are though, I ordered a pair of Cardas Golden reference XLR ICs yesterday.

The Mc is working out pretty good. Still trying to decide whether to get the pre-amp or not. I'm thinking about getting one of their tube pre-amps but in no hurry unless a deal comes up. Thanks for all the suggestions.

regards, David
spectron
130 posts
 
I am glad you solved your problem - your soultion was #2 in my post:

http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?aamps&1206198464&openflup&4&4#4

You sertainly did not care about solution #1 and its your right, of course.

Finally, in just a few years, when switching power supplies will be able to comptete with traditional ones (in sound that is), your 180 lbs tube amp will weight may be 90 lbs.

Enjoy your tubes!!!!

Simon
audphile1's avatar
audphile1
5,371 posts
 
Simon, 402 is a solid state amplifier.

Hey wireless, I suggest you do get a preamp. I recently had a Bel Canto DAC3 for demo, as well as Slim Transporter. To make it short, DAC3 is an awesmoe dac! But, run directly into my amp, yeah, the sound was good, but it was 2-dimensional and had very little to offer as far as being involving. However, inserting my ARC LS25 tube preamp back into the loop changed things dramatically. Everything takes a shape, soundstage gets deeper, sound is more natural. So I suggest you consider a preamp in the future, and possibly a tubed one, like McIntosh's own MC2200. Will take your system a notch higher.
wireless200 OP
415 posts
 
Added Golden Reference XLRs today. Improved an already good sound. I was wary of anything that would increase the highs of course. I took a chance with the GR after having read the Golden Cross was super smooth.

The Golden reference ICs brought out additional detail but it was actually more depth than treble. Very good improvement from top to bottom. I hate to admit but the expensive cables worked. They cost 6 times as much as the RCAs I removed but it was clearly an inprovement. I noticed it immediately. I had tried a lot of different cables but this one really changed the whole sound for the better. It wasn't subtle. A lot more depth, clarity, and definition without edge. I really feel like the sound is getting to a sweet spot.

The preamp is still a question. I can get a c45 at a reasonable price just really no place to put it on my rack. And of course don't want to mess with a good thing. I like to have the trigger though so I wouldn't need to turn the amp on and off manually. And the tone control though it seems less relevant than before.

Earlier tonight I actually considered buying some Golden Reference speaker cables after hearing the difference the ICs made. A pair of 2M Golden reference are very expensive. Maybe it would sound better but even I'd have to admit I'd be crazy to pay that much for cables.

I'm talking myself out of it by saying the speaker cables handle higher voltages whereas the ICs are much lower voltages and thus more sensitive to the type of cable used.
More to discover