DAC instead of Pre-amp

Seriously consider Paul's new Tad Predac, it's supposed to be outstanding and betters the old Tadac

I'd like to weigh in here because I've been doing some experimenting lately and I think what I've heard might be helpful. I have owned a Meitner BiDat that has it's own volume regulator and, for years, I have run it directly into various amps via balanced cables. The clarity and articulation are stunning. HOWEVER, I have read few articles about preamps that convinced me to try a tube based preamplifier now that I've upgraded my speakers (Thiel CS3.7's). I was a complete skeptic but a buddy of mine in our local audio society brought over a VTL 5.5 tube preamp and we hooked it up. I was dumbfounded. The sound is more three dimensional, digital edge is reduced and the pacing is, for lack of a better term, more musical. I was dead set against this because now I have to buy a preamp and my budget is stretched. Now, I am sure that there are a whole host of preamps that might not improve your particular set up. I may have lucked out with the VTL. I plan on trying Musical Fidelity and Audio Research before I buy. Anyway, I thought you'd want to hear form a died-in-the-wool-who-needs-a-preamp skeptic like me.

Vhiner

hear hear!

I'd be interested in hearing just how many folks with those top level preamps, dumped them to go straight DAC to amp instead.

Your experiences are my own, although in reverse. nevertheless, I feel likewise. The body texture, and dimensionality all were natily developed, increased, or improved upon by the use of the Thor preamp.

I'd love to exp what things could sound like with your DAC vs. my own. I feel that is the bottleneck in digital only systems always... the DAC.

Even running directly into my tube amps with the BC DAC3, something remains left out IMO.

Albeit... if, as with yourself, you've not experienced it you simply won't know... not knowing isn't all bad either. Very often though, it's way less expensive... which is my point exactly.

Like any other component in the Audio Chain; Preamps or Line Stages do make a difference, good ones may improve the sound, poor ones may worsen the sound, and no Preamp will have no effect on the sound. This could either be good or bad.

Last year, I had a Bel Canto DAC3 hooked directly up to my amps and it sounded very good, so I thought…, until I hooked the DAC up to an old VTL Super Deluxe Preamp and the overall presentation had improved even further. The improvements with the preamp in the loop revealed a deeper soundstage, more realistic presence and midrange, better authority and dynamics, and more involving PRAT.

Then I upgraded my Preamp to the more costly MBL 6010D and connected it to the Bel Canto DAC3 and this time around the results were even better than before. I noticed further improvements in 3-D imaging, tonality, timbre, resolution, decay, transparency, and PRAT with the MBL preamp in the chain, as opposed to just using the Bel Canto DAC3 to drive the Amps directly.

After my experiences, I can no longer imagine not having a high quality preamp in my system.

Rich

The volume control in most DAC's is indeed implemented in the digital domain and, therefore when adjusted down, bits are lost AND so is sound quality. This is a fact of digital volume controls.   In other words, reducing a DAC's volume causes bits to be dropped resulting in reduced sound quality.

As an experiment, I discovered that my 2nd DAC sounded better than my first DAC both going direct to my power amplifier.  My assumption is DAC #1 was dropping more digital bits then DAC #2 causing the sound quality differences.  Based on this experiment, I am now considering using a pre-amp.

I also continue to believe that everyone has a different opinion on going either direct to a power amplifier or using a pre-amplifier.  I believe these differences are because we all hear differently and different equipment sounds different in different conditions.