Setup vs. Amp/Preamp choice?


Which do you value more?

I've read endless questions re: which amp, preamp,or integrated is best with which speakers. I believe most of that discussion is nonsense for most equipment. True, there are certain electrical synergies between amps and speakers that are important, and preamps certainly sound different. But the absolutely critical factors in determining what a system will sound like are: 1. your own likes and dislikes and 2. setup. I have heard great gear sound terrible and average gear sound fantastic - it really depends on how things were set up in a particular listening room. I've heard people describe a particular integrated amp as having as small soundstage - In my room and with my speakers, the soundstage was vast. I've heard people describe the sound of certain gear as shrill or unlistenable - Well perhaps it is in their setup, but what does that tell me about how it will sound in my room?

Many of you who ask for advice about gear place inordinate value on subjective opinions of individuals with varying tastes, hearing ability, prejudices, rooms and setups. That is completely absurd: The only way to judge how a piece of equipment will sound is to test it in your room after proper setup. And small changes in speaker placement can make a huge difference. So stop running around like a bunch of maniacs who have to switch equipment every few months in search of nirvana, and concentrate on setting up your system properly. That's where the greatest reward is (for everyone except dealers).

Do you agree?
msratty
It's like in business buy low, sell high.

Amp-Pre

Low output impedance drives high input impedance. The higher the difference the less sonic losses in the signal path.
If for some reason you can't neglect an output impedance than it's in the circuit with the input impedance of the next component where you sustain voltage drop. For example you're about to get an amplifier with input impedance of 10k and you've heard the super great reviews on preamp that apperently without your knowlege have 1.5kOhm output impedance. When you connect these two units that had superior reviews on the magazines and other media, they don't sound right not only to your ear, but to the ear of anyone visiting you to listen to your rig and you'd ask yourself why???
Simply because your loss is near 15% on the path from amp to preamp. This causes diminished details espesially on the slopes of the frequency bandwidth of both components or they appear in the dissonant way when you turn the volume up.
The rule of 1:10 of output/input impedance is acceptible and within common sence, but leaves with very limited volume range when the sound is natural and pleasant. To me isn't enough. Maybe it's enough for monotonic and compressed signals, but for wide dynamic range certainly should be higher.

Power Amplifier (and/or integrated)

I personally prefer to overpower speakers and consider only models with larger than 100Wpc. Low sound frequencies can be considered as DC when designing a linear circuits. Voice coils are inductive by nature and inductor has Zero impedance at DC! Low audiable frequencies >50Hz require 2...3x higher power to induce EMF and mechanical vibration than the rest of frequency bandwidth. There's no way that 20Wpc amp will be able to bring any voice coil to audiably move at bellow 60Hz of even high-efficiency speakers... maybe marketwise, but not engineeringwise. Another words no power -- no bass.
Integrated amplifier is the one having near perfectly matched both stages in one unit. It saves you space, wires and nowdays easy to find the one with the power you need. Another words highly marketable and recommended vs. separates. So forget about the first para if you're realy planning to go integraded -- the best to begin with and after playing with separates(swapping reconnecting like an 8yo) grow up and get one again!

Speakers.

As I've mentioned above, speakers either high or low efficiency, have its own impedance curves that you should pay more attention. For direct-coupled SS amplifiers(no capacitor or transformer on the output stage) the speaker selection is substantially wider due to their low output impedance. For transformer-coupled SS or tube amps the degree of impedance curve stability is a factor to consider. For directly-coupled tube amplifiers OTL you should only consider the lowest impedance value to be within the amplifier specified range of loads. They react positively on the impedance increase.
No. Certain amp/pre-amp combo's are completely inadequate for the speaker systems that they are paired with, yet, when accompaning the right equipment will excel. Try a single ended 300b amp, or a tube amp with modest power and mate either with a pair of Martin Logans and you will immediately see what I mean. No amount of room placement will correct that. Passive pre-amps may simply not provide the gain that is required in a particular system. High "spec" powered systems my provide lots of head room, but sound shrill, brittle, and downright nasty, exacerbated by a pair of highly efficient speakers, and again, I don't care how much time you take to set that up. On the other hand, you are correct when you state that system set up is important, and it does dissappoint me to see some people spend 20-40,000 dollars on equipment, only to set it up so badly that they simply should have bought a Bose system and been happy. (Not to knock Bose, but I hope you catch my drift). If your not going to invest the time to set a system up properly, you really might as well purchase something more in accord with what one really needs in that situation: something nice that will provide "background music".
Mcfarland, if you read my post carefully, you'll see that I said that my comments were true for most systems. Most amps will work fine with most speakers. There are combinations that truly excel, but for most people who have systems in the $5k - $15k range, I believe that set up is all important and it's been my experience that the vast majority of those systems are not properly set up.
Setup: IF you include the room. Not only 'setup' of where/ how the equipment, but any room 'tuning' needed.

I'd rather have an OK system in a great space than a great system in some echo chamber....