RE: Better...Classe CA-2200 or Levinson 333-5-6?


For the last two years, I've had a used ML333 amp that had been paired with a pair of Apogee Duetta Signatures. With the loads that those speakers need, the ML333 was one of the few amps that wouldn't get fried in handling those speakers. Unfortunately, my cat decided about a month ago to sit on top of it and let loose with cat urine that fried the components to where the estimates to repair the unit start at $2,600 and could go to $4,000.

At first, I was committed to getting another ML333, or a 335 or 336 because I loved the ML so much.

After turning over numerous rocks in trying to find a replacement and coming up dry on those fronts, I'm leaning heavily toward making a massive change to my system. Knowing that my amp choices are significantly limited when paired with the Apogees, I came across a pair of Martin Logan Prodigys that I'm considering making my primary speakers in place of the Duetta Signatures. The Apogees had been part of a system that included a pair of Vandersteen 2Ces, and two Vandersteen 2Ws (one powered and one not). To power the sub, I had an Aragon 8002 to handle that job, along with sending the signal to the powered one as well. The 333 easily powered the Apogees and 2Ce's in tandem.

From what I've been told, if I went with the Prodigys, they are much easier to drive than Apogees, so my range of usable amps would be significantly larger. In place of my fried ML333, I've been told about the Classe CA-2200 could handle the job, with one offered that would come with the full 5-year warranty.

With the added bass that the Prodigys I think can handle, I'm thinking of trading in my unpowered 2W, along with the Duetta Signatures, and even possibly the Aragon amp.

I'm wondering how much of an upgrade people think I would be achieving, going from a system that had a ML333, Aragon 8002, Apogee Duetta Signatures, Vandersteen 2Ce's, and a pair of Vandersteen 2Ws to one with Martin Logan Prodigys, Vandersteen 2Ce's, a single powered Vandersteen 2W, all working off the Classe CA-2200. The investment for the purchased equipment will likely be in the area of $9K, and the return on what I would sell would likely be in the area of about $2,750, netting a total investment of slightly more than $6K. If I went with holding steady in getting another ML amp, I'll likely have to spend another $3.5K to $4K, so a difference of a couple of thousand between the two.

Any thoughts?
acaamano
Don't write off your Duetta Sigs so quickly. They are not nearly as tough a load as the original Apogee Full Range and Scintila, which went down to 1 ohm. The Duetta Sigs are a 3-4 ohm mostly resistive load. Lots of amps including tubes can drive them successfully.

I used Duetta Sigs for about 5 years. At first I used a pair of Krell KMA100 MKII Monoblocks but replaced them with a pair of Pass Aleph 1.2 monoblocks. The Alephs are not the best amps for driving ultra low impedance loads but did fine with the Duetta Sigs. They were a sweet sounding combination.

I upgraded the Duetta Sigs to Apogee Studio Grands about 7 years ago, and the Alephs are still in use and making glorious music.

I think a lot of modern amps will handle your Duetta Sigs with no problems.
how are you going to keep the cat off the new amp?

All ways a fear of mine and one reason I have not replaced my Proceed HPA2 yet... (sealed on top)
To Davt:

I spent some "time with it" yesterday, first at the store to test it with the Prodigys that are on consignment. I wasn't floored by the Prodigys, though, as I found them very detailed on songs full of detail, and with impressive bass that were heavy in that department as well, but when songs were complex, with a mix of highs and lows, I found the Prodigys to emphasize the bass moreso, with the highs getting lost in the shuffle.

I decided then to take the CA-2200 home for further listening (as that was easier than getting the Prodigys home for a listen), but in my own room and my own system. I was impressed with how it worked there, particularly with how it made the Apogees sound. I'm not look for an amp with a "slam," but one that doesn't lie, and is very exacting in its reproduction.

I think you are accurate about your "timbre" comment, as I came away with the same sense when I listened to the CA-2200 in my home setting.

For what I was willing to spend on a Mark Levinson that is anywhere from 10 to 15 years old, the Classe seems to be a great value in being new with a full warranty and being less than $1,000 more than the used Levinson.

To Ghostrider45:
While I was at first enamored with the idea of getting a set of Logans, I have come away more torn in not wanting to "write off" the Duetta Signatures. The only problem is that a few months ago, I began to hear some vibrations from one of the panels (the one that was repaired in 1996 by ADS when I stupidly tried to install the feet while sitting down and resting the speaker on my knee, only for it to slip and fall into a stack of equipment, damaging the bass panel) and I'm thinking that the foam in that panel needs to be replaced. The other panel has no such resonances. So the consideration of that repair cost/time is now bouncing around in my head as well.

From what it sounds like, the CA-2200 should, by itself, handle the Duetta Signatures load, even if it can't handle the combination of both the Duettas and the 2Ce's together, as a Classe rep told me by e-mail himself.

To no_money:

Keeping the cat off will be a challenge. I have a rack that has 9-inch spaces, and while the CA-2200 does "fit", it only leaves a quarter-inch gap above it. Classe on it's Web site cites the need for at least six inches of space, so I'm thinking of putting it on the top of my rack, which would keep it open, but at that height of about three feet, I don't see my cat ever making that leap, as she never even tried in the seven years I've had her. Where the Levinson was on the floor, largely because of its 125 pound heft and my concern of that weight on the top of my rack, she just had to climb up. The Classe is "lighter" at 92 pounds, and I think the rack can conceivably handle that weight at the top.
as far as the bass overiding the highs and mids on complex parts... on my Ascents I had that issue, great bass but just "too much" for my room. I used the attenuator on the back to drop the bass by -3db and it worked wonders. I am not that familiar with the Prodigy but there should be an adjustement on the back. Give it a shot.
cover the top of the amp with a piece of carpet imbedded with razor blades (just don't block the any airvents); I'll bet that keeps the cat off the amp.