2. amps-preamps
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Need info on amp rec. for these Thiel cs2.4's

Ok, this is my last attempt before I have Crutchfield take the speakers back.

let me say that when things on these speakers sound right it trully is amazing. On most other average CD recordings though the speakers sound tends towards the brighter side. I just recently purchased a NAD M51 DAC and it helped and is a first rate piece of equipent - I have a review on Audiogon if your interested. However, while Im generally happy with the speakers I think either I need to change the amp or get a CJ preamp - ET2 (or similar). Im using the NAD to drive the Amp (a Vincent sp331 - 150 @ 8 ohms and 300 at 4 ohms) directly so no preamp at this time. I hooked up my friends 5082 Adcom for kicks and the treble is good there, but there is no space or dimension to the music. Thus my thoughts on changing the amp. Its flat. He also has a VTL 2.5 preamp that helps by the virtue that it is a tube piece and helps plump up the mids while softening the highs (thus my thoughts of CJ preamp). However sticking a piece of equipment in between the source and amp seems like a backwards step.

Im dedicated to at most $3500 dollars to bring the system in line for the hights. Problem is I have nowhere near me that I can go to listen to the equipment before purchase so its all online for me, so I'd need to be able to puchase it that way. Im not a big fan of used but I could go there if necessary.

Some thoughts on amps:

Channel Islands d200 MKII
Parasound Halo 21

Preamp thoughts:

CJ ET-2
Rogue 99

What my thoughts on what the amp should do is be warm, solid state, not emphsize the highs obviously, balanced or unbalanced, and have at leat near if not more that 300w into 4 ohms. I've heard dampening is important with Thiels but not sure what the numbers mean.

Please any thoughts would be appreciated on my situation here.

My urgency in this is I have till May 17th before I need to tell Crutchfield to take them back.

Now I do really like the speakers and I know many people will tell me to do just that - they are so close to being "there"! But let's use that as a last resort on info here b/c I know I have that option.
last_lemming
stevecham
3,340 posts
 
I have had the 2.4s for two years, purchased new and I expected these to take quite awhile to break in, and in this regard they did not disappoint. Both Thiel and the dealer told me to be patient and simply let them play and do their thing. Frankly, it took a year of at least 6 hours per week of playing at moderate volumes before I felt that the remaining bit of glare at the top end settled down and the bass began to really open up.

You can certainly warm things up with CJ equipment, perhaps a preowned 2500 amp with one of their preamps will work nicely; I use a CAV50 control amp (much to the chagrin of some other Agoners) with excellent results. These are not hard to drive.

What I can tell you is that we have a small audiophile group locally here and whenever it's my turn to host the evening, my guests are always looking forward to listening to this system. I have had comments like, "if ever you decide to sell those speakers, call me." Then again, we always only play vinyl.
audiojan's avatar
audiojan
406 posts
 
Thiel and McIntosh sounds amazing together.... I would start looking there.

Also, I agree that driving the amp directly from the dac might be part of your problem.

I do have a pair of Thiel 2.4's driven by Krell. Works well for me.

How's your room? You may need to add some dampening to the room, curtains, a couple of acoustic panels, maybe some thick tapestry on the wall behind the speakers....
tonywinsc
583 posts
 
I must agree that the Thiels are demanding speakers and it takes the right amplifier to make them sound their best. In general, they require an amp with high current capability. As a rule of thumb, a SS amplifier that doubles power output as impedence is halved down to 2 Ohms has high current capability. My experince early on with Thiel speakers proved this rule. The amplifier that I was using with my old planar speakers, which sounded great, did not work so well with the Thiels. (The planars were a pure resistive load.) People on the 'gon use tube amps with Thiels too, I just have no experience with that combo. Once I found the amp that I have now, I did not need to keep searching.
last_lemming OP
639 posts
 
I think what I am going to try to do is audition (buy with option to send back) the Channel Island D200 MKII's. From all the reviews I've been reading they have a very "tube" sound with a warm midrange and smooth highs without any harshness or grain. They are rated at 200w into 8 and 375w into 4.

Worst case scenario is I'll have to pay for restocking, but I've heard nothing but good things about these amps. I will try my preamp again with all the different amp combinations. Just last night I hooked up my old CJ MF2100 and while it didn't have any real power to drive the speakers the highs weren't bad on that amp directly hooked up the NAD. So while I don't disagree with there being an issue the NAD directly connected to the amp, the brightness only rears its head with the Vincent amp. Hey, if Im wrong I'll be the first to admit it and have the restocking charge to prove it.
unsound
7,329 posts
 
With all due respect to Stevecham, the Thiel 2.4's are not easy to drive.
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