Lamm LL2.1 Deluxe "DC Offset"?


Hi there,

Is there anybody who has a deep experiences with high fluctuated "DC offset" in Lamm LL2.1 Deluxe PreAmp?.

My Lamm LL2.1 Deluxe Preamp shows a highly fluctuated DC reading that reaching +-200mV even more. Last night measurement showed a flucuated reading and reached +-300mV.

A three weeks continuous observation shows that the preamp DC fluctuation seems higly affected by the swing/fluctuation of AC Volatage,day time and night time. I can see that even as small as 0.3V AC voltage abrupt swing will directly generate significant DC offset in the LL2.1.

Your sharing experience and advices are higly appreciated.
gr-gin
Am very very surprised by LAMM's lack of effective response to resolve the issue. And this, coming from such a reputable company, can only augur bad things for the company.

I was seriously considering buying a Lamm pre but after reading this, no way... not with such mentality....
Just to put things into perspective here, I have owned a few Lamm components over the years and still cherish my ML2 power amps. I also owned the L2 line stage for a number of years. On occasion, the line stage and amps needed attention. Since I live in the NY area, I was able to deliver the equipment directly to Lamm. It was repaired quickly and inexpensively, and each time, the units were checked, cleaned and on occasion re-tubed (with my prior approval).
The chief difficulty with a company like Lamm is that it is a small operation. This has benefits, in that you can get Vlad on the phone but drawbacks if he is occupied. (I guess I like gear from small 'one man' companies, because I own a phono stage from Allnic, which is similarly the product of one man).
I understand working through a dealer if you are not in the immediate area and don't want to get involved in the cost and risk of shipping. (Although the Lamm stuff is packed in serious wooden crates).
I can't directly troubleshoot your problem, since I was using the Lamm linestage with Lamm amps. But, I generally trust Vlad to do the right thing-
and, also understand why, given the size of the company, he prefers that customers work with his dealers.
Whart,
I can appreciate your positive experience with Lamm products. Doesn't it seem in this particular case Gr-gin's concerns are being brushed off to some degree given the time that's elapsed?
Regards,
Charles- I am not defending Vlad, but put it into context. I assume the OP is overseas, I may be wrong. As far as I know in the US, Vlad has no authorized repair centers; apart from tubes, in my experience the gear goes back to Lamm Industries in Brooklyn for any repair. It seems there are two alternatives here: one, to see if the dealer can sort the problem (my experience with dealers has varied widely over the years, from ones who I would trust with my life and others who are so horrible I wouldn't go public only because it would probably be defamatory). I have no idea how effective the dealer can be in the circumstance, giving him every benefit of the doubt.
The other alternative is to ship the unit to Vlad after making arrangements to do so, with a rough idea of what expected turnaround time would be. Since Vlad builds the darn things, he can get to the bottom of any issue quickly. The biggest obstacle is shipping and delays associated with that. (Although, FWIW, I got stuff shipped from Allnic in days- Korea to NY. Crazy). If it were me, I'd probably opt to have the unit looked over by Vlad.
As to whether this particular preamp doesn't work well with some power amps, I haven't a clue. It does sound like that was one of the messages given to the OP, either by Lamm or the dealer (i'll have to go back and re-read the various excerpts that were posted).
The point of my earlier post was to address the practical exigencies- Lamm is a small operation without the kind of 'customer service' staff you often find at larger manufacturers. (Vlad's wife handles part of the intake and she is charming and usually pretty good about responding to emails). And, I get why, in the first instance, Lamm would urge the dealer to try to sort the problem, particularly if the dealer is close by- the dealer can go to the customer's house, can try and troubleshoot the unit, rather than figure it out over the phone, etc. For that reason, I don't think Lamm is giving the OP the 'brush off.' That said, I still think the best option is to send the unit back to the factory. If it turns out that there is some fundamental incompatibility in how the unit works with certain kinds of amps, and nothing is wrong with the preamp, that's a different issue. But, to definitely determine whether something is wrong, I'd arrange to have the dealer send it back, as described above. Worst case, presumably, if the OP bought it from that dealer, is that he works something out for a different product, assuming the unit checks OK .
P59teitel
I agree with you. But the fact is the dealer and their authorized technician do not want to do that. I am not in the position to forced them to do so because, having learn of their attitude from this 3 months struggle, I am afraid they will forced me back to take any consequences. May be, they do know that the real problem is not in the caps.

Lall
I can understand that you already spend your time and thought in considering to buy Lamm product. I spend quite a lot of time and reading some reviews before decided to buy it, and this is the product that I adore to own for at least two reasons: 1) It has good reviews from at least two reputable audio Magazine like The Absolute Sound and Stereophile, 2) Just like Whart said, it’s a one man company product that usually have its own reflection, taste and heritage of the designer. Actually I plan to keep the unit for last, such kind of collection unit.
I do not expect to experience this kind of difficulties and such improper attitudes. But this also gives us a very good lesson learns when contemplating to choose and buy a product.

Whart
I learn 3 important things from your posting:
1) You are very lucky live in NY area, and this gives you an advantage to have a direct contact with the Lamm where they also located in NY. Therefore, this is very easy for you to prove them whenever you experience or find some trouble with your Lamm equipments. There won’t be any arguments and debates on whose observation/finding is correct and whose is wrong, you can simply drop the unit and have them repair it. I can’t imagine if someone across the continent and ocean, with a big spending/investment on the Lamm equipments, experiencing trouble with their equipments…...
2) Your statement of “On occasion, the line stage and amps needed attention….”, give me an understanding and prove that Lamm equipment is not a risk-free or trouble-free equipment. Therefore, a good relationship and trust between the customer-dealer-manufacturer is of mandatory, otherwise people will get lot of bad experiences like mine.
3) “…trust Vlad to do the right thing and also understand why …..he prefers that customers work with his dealers……”. This drives me to concern on a) what if the customers finally getting frustrated from the way dealers treat them? b) what if dealers and their technicians do not know what to do when they facing unusual case, the case that only the manufacturer can handle and give a right and correct direction?. When you invest in the Lamm equipments, though they considered being a small operation, it certainly cost you a big money spending, and you deserve a very good and fair treatment.

Charles1dad
Indeed, I already spent about 3 months facing this difficulties, but so far does not see any clear solution from them……
Again, If I were Lamm, I will contact dealer and :
1) Give them clear understanding what the design of the unit is really.
2) Give them clear and precise instruction on how to observe, find and solve the problem.