2. pc-audio
  3. 1168589271

Help with PC Audio Quality vs. CD

I hope someone with real experience can help out with this. I am having a hard time getting the same quality sound from a PC that I get from a CD player. I recently built a HTPC running Windows MCE and ripped all my cd's using lossless compression. I'm using an M-Aduio Audiophile 192 sound card and run a coax digital out of the PC to an external DAC and to my amps. It just sounds flat to me, not that it's not clear sounding, but the bass is weaker, I can hear a harshness that's not there if I run any old CD player to the DAC through the same connection. Has anyone else experienced this? I keep reading in this forum that people are saying how much better the computer transport is in theory, but I have yet to witness it. I heard that the Windows KMixer is the problem. I tried ASIO and Kernal Streaming drivers that are supposed to bypass this, and it sounds clearer, but still not as 3-dimentional and "black background" as a CD player (and I mean ANY cheap CD player, I've tried 3!)

Can someone out there with an external DAC try this and let me know their results? Use a DVD player or anything with a digital out... I don't get it. My soundcard alone cost 3 times as much as the cheap DVD player I tried and it doesn't sound as good. Anyone experience this or have any suggestions?

Here's my system so you can understand the sound I'm looking for.

I have an external MSB Link DAC III Full Nelson that I've been using for years and I really like the sound of it. I've been using a couple Sony CD changers and running them to a MSB Digital Director that will automatically switch between digital inputs, out to the DAC, then to a tube pre and tube power amp (modded dynaco ST70) and out to a pair of Monitor Audio GR10's. This system (with the right tubes) sounds so sweet to me. I'm into the huge soundstage, crisp, smooth sound - melty mid-range... you know, the analog tube sound!

I have experience in recording studios and work professionally in computers, so I have a good understanding of both, so don't be afraid to get technical with me. Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

Ben
thesauce
thesauce OP
21 posts
 
Shadorne - Thanks for your responses, but I think there's more to it than that:

"You should avoid any D to A and A to D conversion. Clearly by sending things through your sound card then you are making a conversion somewhere in the PC. Clipping in an A to D might explain what you describe."

There is no A to D conversions... going sttraight out the SPDIF of the sound card to an external DAC.

"If you are not making a D to A and A to D conversion then the sound cannot change between a CD played in your PC or from a separate CD transport."

I used to beleive this, but it's not true, as you can read about the KMixer. I also beleive it goes beyond just the KMixer, since I've tried ASIO drivers that bypass it. Anything the computer does to process the sound affects it, even though you're in the dital realm.

"Another possibility is that their is a bug in your compression and de-compression steps that introduces losses."

I get the same results when running an uncompressed file (WAV).

Ben
thesauce OP
21 posts
 
Ryanmii -

Yeah, I'm using ASIO with WinAmp and Foobar2000 for testing purposes (although I like MCE because of the remote, there is an obvious quality loss when using it). The ASIO undoubtebly sounds better, a lot clearer, no distortion that is audible like when going through the Kmixer, but it's still not as 3d as a regular CD transport to the DAC... Arghhhh...

Thanks,

Ben
thesauce OP
21 posts
 
Jax2 -

I think you may be right. I guess it may be a power source issue with an internal card sharing the dirty power in the computer... has anyone tried the Trends Audio UD-10? I am considering it since it's a USB and uses seperate power (even a battery pack if you want) and it's for 130 bucks! I just don't know how much of an issue the power is, vs. the clocking that makes it sound better. I'm sure it's not the best clock in the $130 unit.

Thanks,

Ben
thesauce OP
21 posts
 
Jax2 -

I talked with Steve from Empirical and he seems to really know his stuff. His products sound like a great solution, but a little pricey... but may very well be worth it. I am curious though if anyone out there using cheaper units have got their computer to sound as good as a CD transport? I've had replies on how the USB devices sound "better" than internal cards, but can someone experiment with a CD player and tell me if it sounds as good or better? Also, anyone use Vista with MCE? I hear they fixed the Kmixer issue... that would be great!

Ben
gmood1
1,251 posts
 
Ben I'll let you know what I think of the Trends unit when it arrives..hopefully this week. Right now I'm using a optical out directly to the Dac. I also use Foobar, SRC and the ASIO with Kernal Streaming . The sound is terrific now..it has me wondering how much better it can get. I think my unit has the newer software with the Kmixer fix.... not sure though.

Have you tried the Secret Rabbit code?..it helps the sound quite a bit!
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