At this price point I would strongly suggest taking a look at Lamm M1.2 mono blocks. |
Silentrunning, without being unpleasant about it, your response is totally irrevelant to the question I asked. I find it annoying , regardless of the topic of the thread, when someone only wants information concerning specific gear and someone brings in other pieces that are not what the poster was interested in. If I had asked what amps anyone could suggest in the $20000.00 price range your response then would have been a helpful one. So, I hope this is not taken as a personnal rant, I just hope that individuals will offer information requested and not something they like or have experience with. |
I hear what you are saying Teajay, but is sometimes very helpful to have alternatives to what is being considered pointed out to you. It would be nice to have some direct comparison backing-up the need for straying. Good luck in your search. |
Teajay, I was suprised when my friend told me that be bought DartZeel NHB108. He is having same Amati Anniversario speaker as I do. So, two days ago I visit him and we listen to his system(Anniversario,NHB108,NHB18 and ARC CD3MkII)... Results? Well, his NHB108 has only 300hours on it and NHB18 is dealer loan but, my system is better by far. I will keep my opinion for myself but, Dart costs 18000Euro in Europe! It is a good(but,IMO not excellent) amp... I would also like to audition Pass XA160 monos.
I bet that many people here on Agon will rave about Dart and say to all of us that Dart is the best amp ever.
Last thing, my friend is also not very happy with Dart but, he needs to live with it(he traded ARC VT200MkII and REF2MkII for Dartzeel NHB108-some extra cash were also involved!). |
We have a good deal of listening time invested in each of the amps you mention, they are both very nice sounding amps.
That having been said, I would (still) strongly suggest Lamm M1.2's. Much more amp(s) for about the same $
Sorry, I should have added those details before...I hope your ok with this post.
http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/dartzeel_nhb108_modelone.htm |
Branimar, only 300 hours on the dartzeel. really if it does not sound competent at 300 hours it will never souud good. But you all ready know that right:)
ps I'll give everyone a secret tip, consance cyber 800. 78 watts of pure tube heaven.
do you think this will drive Amati Anniversario. Is it really that much easier to drive to get effortless music from them.? ie compared to Vienna Mahler? |
Downunder -> I heard the Aniversarios driven by 40W tube amp (using 4xKT88 tubes). The combination souded excelent, so I assume the new SFs are not a that difficoult to drive. |
Downunder, as Elberoth2 said Anniversario's could be driven with lower power tube amp. But, from my experience you will need 70W tube amp or 100W ss amp for start.
Tube amp should be able to handle 4ohm load as well as ss amp. We all know that some amps have a tough time with speakers that are droping below 4ohms... |
I have had the Dartzeel for about 3 months and it came broken in. Only recently have the full potential seem to bust out. It extricates more music than any amp I have EVER owned. The Dartzeels 100 watts sounds more dynamic and powerful than amps with a 300 watt rating(tube or SS). An amp that it rivals would be the audio research-600. You owe it to yourself to check one of these amps out |
the dartzeel is strictly flavor of the month.not what one would hope from a major investment. the pass labs monoblocks have consistantly been among reference quality. |
I would never in my wildest dreams describe the darTZeel NHB-108 as the flavor of the month. More like the flavor of the century. I have heard many amps including some of the best from Pass, Audio Research, VTL, conrad-johnson, Lamm, Mark Levinson, ASR Emitter Exclusive, McIntosh, and others too numerous to mention. Nothing could have prepared me for the sound my speakers would produce being driven by the darTZeel. The darT leaves nothing to be desired, only to be imagined, even compared to the world's best tube amps. As great as the other amps are from the fore-mentioned manufacturers, the darT is at least 15% - 20% better. In the world of ultra high end that's a lot! Take it from me, it's impossible to form any opinion on the darT without hearing one in your system. The USA importer can not sell this amp properly over the phone because if he really told you what it's capable of, everyone would write him off as exaggerating. I bought the amp and the pre-amp is on order. |
if you are crazy enough to spend 20k on an amp (remember reviewers and dealers(even buying one-offs get these much much cheaper)you are ready for the dartzeel. |
I think the darTZeel NHB-108 is appropriately priced when compared to other top of the line amps from other manufacturers. Audio Research's Reference 210's are $29,000 and to my ears aren't nearly as good. The sonic performance offered by the darT is probably second to none. IMHO if you have speakers that are above 89db efficient the darT's are the best money can buy. |
I need to correct my last post. The Reference 210's are $19,000 a pair. I still greatly prefer the darTZeel NHB- 108. Sorry for any confusion. |
I have had the darTZeel amp and pre-amp for several months now and can only agree with Arthurp, that they are truly an awesome sounding combination. The 50 ohm constant impedance link between the amp and pre-amp is pure genius and outperforms easily an RCA or XLR connection (I A/B'ed both against the 50 ohm and it was no contest). Yes, the amp takes 300-400 hours to really burn in before it is at its best...unfortunate, but that's the price to pay for excellence. I have not heard the Pass Labs or the Lamms...I'm sure they and many others are also excellent. I did compare the dart to the ASR Emitter II, Linn, Boulder 2010/2050's, Halcro dm10/dm68's, ARC, VTL and the dart is in another league IMHO in terms of its utter lack of artifacts and ability to deliver the very best of tube and solid state strengths. The amp may not have the power to drive inefficient speakers in a very large room, but it drives my Dynaudio Temptations (which are 4 ohm and 90db efficient) just fine.
I doubt very much that dart will become a "flavor of the month or even year". The designs were 20+ years in the making and I think it will be awhile before it is matched or bested, but if it happens that fine, we as audiophiles will all benefit.
Happy Listening. |
