@dr-john,
Sorry, I don’t remember what cables they were using at the show. Simaudio components are very neutral and transparent, I would try couple of cables that doesn’t ‘color’ the sound.
May I recommend Audience Au24 SE or Acrolink 7N-D7000 AES/EBU cables. I’ve used both of these cables and they are excellent cables under $1K. |
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lalitk
re: the Moon stack you heard. Any idea what aes/ebu cable carried the bytes from their transport to the 780D ? I just bought their demo DAC from them, but they are not forthcoming with the aes/ebu they used - why I don't know, but I want to maximize performance at home as much as is evidenced at the show. Thanks, - Dr John.
(PS I am not so affluent as to join the'Cable of the Month' Club, having just dropped 15K on their DAC itself.) |
My thoughts on this: I sensed desperation in many rooms, way to loud with the door open playing to the people in the hall.
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If i were running a room i would play one minute of a track and move on to a different song . Would play all genres of music as well . Think you could keep peoples attention better and have longer stays . The paradigm room did this . Kept you on your feet anticipating whats coming next . |
The music in most rooms was not good . I observed people leave , myself included when the music was boring .We are talking clear the room boring . Felt bad as we all headed out at the same time . I did observe in the Ryan audio room when i requested neil young be played that more people were coming in . Could be a coincidence but the door was open to the hall so the music could be heard from the hall . |
My wife and I weren't that impressed. Most rooms played some God awful music that we would never listen to so we couldn't make any comparisons. I was extremely disappointed in The Marketplace, not many sellers and everything was at full retail! We walked in and out of many rooms because we couldn't stand the music and nothing really moved us. The last audio show I attended prior to the RMAF was the Stereophile show back in the late 90's in NYC. For one thing, there were many venders selling their products at good discounts and the rooms were much bigger and I enjoyed it more back then. |
From what I saw the show seemed well attended. Most rooms were full, and I quite often had to wait to get a good seat. |
Doesn't sound like many people went. Kind of interesting all these people on line wanting to know what they should purchase and then miss the opportunity to go and hear about every brand and talk to manufactures and other users. Might be the Amazon influence. Just buy on line. |
Last weekend, in Denver, at RMAF was an awesome get-away. Monday off. 4 day work week afterward. Winner!
I heard a couple components I plan to seriously follow-up on. Possibly an in-home audition, if possible.
But seated now, in the sweet spot of my system, a Kenny Barron trio unfolding in front of me, I'm reminded why I do this. The Music. |
Reasons to to go to Hi Fi Shows
1. Simply to have fun. You have a system you really like.
2. You wonder if you system is out dated.
3. You are thinking of updating you system or a part of it.
4. To gloat over how good your system sounds compared to the junk at the show. Just kidding here.
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I remember my first CES in Chicago, main floor was white good (washers, dryers, stoves, etc) and way back in a room was phonograph, Macintosh, and of course, Bill Johnson who in a way started high-end. Times do change.
I went to RMAF to attend Can Jan, the headphone show, I was looking for strategic partners for a new headphone amplifier I am bringing out. Had good success, saw a lot of stuff, the high-end of the market is still alive, maybe not kicking as much as it used to, the demise of the middle class is reflected in such an event. |
I heard the Wilson Sabrina’s with Nagra Classic amp/pre and the dCS Debussy DAC at The Audio Salon in Santa Monica CA a few weeks ago. This combo is very very good. Unfortunately, at retail, it is out of my budget; it sure was amazing though. So I can attest to the Nagra/Wilson synergy. Mr. Wilson himself likes Nagra very much; see his YouTube video. |
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So am I. I think, the more digital everything goes the less connection to the sound becomes. There are still young people interested but not many, as far as I can tell. Next generation is more computer dependent than they or us realize. From this angle, it is totally irrelevant whether or not one day digital sounds better than analog. True connection will be lost. Even most jobs that they do make no sense whatsoever, they are not real jobs, sometimes anti-real. |
One thing I noticed at RMAF, as I rode the elevator up and down and up and down the Denver Tech Center Mariott hotel: There were way more 40-60 year old men than 20-40 year old men. Way More. Where does that leave the future of high-end audio? I'm concerned. |
It may be, sure. Almost every time I am reading about people's impressions, it is Gryphon, Ypsilon, Lamm and Nagra electronics with various speakers that get the praise. Oh yes, and Wavac. And sometimes VAC too. They must be all doing something very right. I also increasingly hear good things about Thales table/arm plus Ikeda cartridge set-up. Perhaps not quite a reference level but very very high. |
inna
I remember one of my first visits to the CES. I was looking mostly for speakers. I found " spectacular " sounding room. I was smitten. I ordered the demo speakers they were using for my show room in Colorado. All wood thick face plate 1.5" thick. Horn 12" horn speakers with a carved face for the drivers. I was in " wow " heaven.
After two months of listening in my demo room with some fine tube amplifiers, Art Audio, Juele Electra, Atmas-sphere, I came to despise them. What had sounded spectacular in the demo room was killing my ears. Bright and forward.
The moral to this anecdote, My opinion is that when a room sounds spectacular or fabulous, that may mean it is way to much in your face.
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When I was in the Gryphon room, they were spinning CDs. They achieved great sound. |
The Nagra room with new HD preamp and amps with Wilson Alexias and the Wilson Benesch with Ypsilon room were my favorites.
The Ayon room with Lumenwhite speakers were good. I was amazed at how large a soundstage was created with speakers so close to the walls! |
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I understand, there was no spectacular sound in any room.
Did Gryphon use analog source in addition to digital?
What was AAudio Imports set-up? Ypsilon with something? |
@soundsrealaudio
i honestly can’t remember but I know it wasn’t Opera (thank God). My wife remarked the sound was “real nice” and believe me for someone who has no interest in Audio it means something.
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Any new SACD player launches?
What about the Tekton room? I understand that they did have a room at the show.
Any other interesting products?
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stereo5
Thanks for coming in. What music were we playing? if you remember.
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I have friends that live in Castle Rock, Colorado and he is an audiophile also. We attended on Saturday and I have to say that I absolutely had a blast. Most of the rooms were nice, and most of the demonstrators were very nice and cordial. I loved the Martin Logan room with Dan De Augustino (spelling?) amplification. The Vandersteen/VTL room was my favorite and Vandersteen the person was very open and personable. The Audio Research room with the Martin Logan Neolith speakers was excellent. Same for Wavelength room. I think those were Wilson Benesch speakers with the Wavelength 8 WPC amps and it was absolutely wonderful. Lots of rooms with Focal Speakers. The one with Krell electronics was a bit too bright for me. Great music tho. Mark Levinson/Revel room was excellent. Many rooms with Magico speakers and they were very nice. Same for Roger Sanders equipment was outstanding and roger Sanders himself was quite nice to speak with. I met Ralph of Atmosphere and he was very friendly. Constellation makes some very nice equipment. Bob Carver was friendly and his speaker system and electronics were quite nice. Didn't get to hear the Legacy systems because they were talking and explaining their system for so long that we couldn't wait any longer. I was disappointed. Lots of small manufacturers that knew their stuff and had some nice equipment. I really liked the Rogers electronics. My one complaint was that there were entirely too many rooms where reviewers or people were talking entirely too loudly with the representatives and others could not enjoy listening to the music and equipment. Why they wouldn't take that crap outside was beyond me and was very rude. I tried to visit each room and took the time to do each floor and have lunch and return for more. We took our time and had an absolute blast. There were more "high end" manufacturers represented than what I expected and the names (people) were there to meet the public also. The Headphone/earphone floor was mind blowing. I didn't realize how many were out there. The competition is rough. The staff was very friendly and helpful. I am so glad I attended. I would do this again. Some equipment I really wanted to hear was there and I was fortunate to hear some. Some rooms played music that left me wondering, what were they thinking? some didn't complement the systems at all. Many rooms had sound absorption equipment, but many more did not and suffered for it. But, you could hear through the problems with rooms and set up and still could discern quality in most equipment. It was nicely done, in my opinion. enjoy
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Favorite rooms (by speaker):
Avantgarde UnoXD- Very natural sounding
Tannoy Kingdom Royal- Very dynamic
Magico (Nordost room)- Hi rez sound
Piega Master Line Source- Amazing transparency
Wilson (Nagra room)- Nice, but a bit boring
Conclusion: You get what you pay for.
Great sound for the money: Paradigm and ELAC floorstanders
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@soundsrealaudio
although I only spent a few minutes in your room, I found it to be one of the better sounding rooms at the show. My favorite was the Nagra room although I could never afford that equipment. The reason I only spent a few minutes in each room was because they were all very warm and my wife and I were dripping with sweat
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Kudos also to PS Audio for making the Focal 3's sound their best. Bad choice for a room, on the first floor lots of traffic and very noisey. |
I spent yesterday there and agree with imgoodwithtools, "Best sound by a decent margin was the Nagra suite. All Nagra electronics driving a pair of Wilson Alexia 2s". Owner did a good job of setup and room treatment to allow for a nice soundstage for many. Also the music choice was very interesting, lots of live shows on tape. |
I agree, the Gryphon room was impressive. It was my wife's favorite. |
Well I did have time to get out of our room at the show. Walked up to the 11th. floor stuck my head some rooms. I walked the floor then walked down a flight to the 10th. then all the way back to our room. My ears are ringing still. Seems to me there are two kinds of speakers. Bright and forward and then and then the layer back put you to sleep.
The two rooms I liked were the Gryphon Room which is in the mezzanine and the AAudio import room which is in the Larkspur room down stairs on the first floor.
Here is a tip. On the mezzanine there is a little table set up with coffee so you don't have to wait in the long Starbuck line.
I would love some feed back from you about our room 7013. Bricasti and Wilson Beseech. I think even Erics's ears would appreciate the music.
I am in the room most of the time and would love to hear from you.
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Thanks! for sharing show attendees.
Happy Listening!
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The elac adante room was good . 5k for that sound ? Hard to believe .
Agree with imgoodwithtools on the Paradigm room . Such transparency without fatigue . When the demonstrator cranked some electronic music it was the most incredible bass i have heard . Just awesome ! |
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Did you go into the ELAC Adante room? |
Best Bang for the Buck: Paradigm. |
I was trying to be kind. I'm not good at it!
;) |
"I would never bash a manufacturer for poor show sound. So I won’t."
Whatta gyp. :) lol
Dave |
Just spent the day at RMAF. I would never bash a manufacturer for poor show sound. So I won't. Best sound by a decent margin was the Nagra suite. All Nagra electronics driving a pair of Wilson Alexia 2s. Rich, engaging, detailed music.
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Two left ears
On Friday I was there. I saw and heard new speakers built in Kentucky designed and spec'd by Ryan of Vapor Audio. There sounded very good with Exogal amps.
Duke Lajune of Audio Kensis had some excellent speakers driven by just a modified pioneer receiver. It had amazing dynamics with regular listenin levels and good lack of distortions that make listening to some pro speakers hard for me.
I got to go now but will mention some more thoughts later if you want. |
@lalitk Thanks. Even better! : ) |
@david_ten
I was referring to seperate Pre and amp due to release in November 2017. IMO, the seperate sounds much better than Integrated, plus chassis finish is a step up as well.
The amp and pre retails for $6k and $4k respectively. |
@lalitk The Anthem STR is up on their site. It's an integrated and has a pre built into it. Listed for US$4499
Is there a specific Pre you are referring to? |
Anyone been to the CPT/Equi=Core room? |
Check out upcoming Anthem STR amp and pre combo for $10K.
Beautiful sound with exquisite build. The graphic display is to die for, lots of power to drive anything out there. |
@lalitk Thanks for the link and for your first product / room updates. Great stuff. Keep it coming. |
Great feedback from stereo5.
Day 1 - So far, the Maroon Peak Room with VAC / Tannoy blew me away. The VAC featuring their Renaissance/Signature - 39K and Tannoy Kingdom Royal MKII - 96K. Effortless sound, super detailed, the room was well equipped with room treatments.
The Esoteric room with Canton speakers ($15k) was also very good, Esoteric stack was around $120K 😳
Aurender room with Magnapan’s, REL sub, Hegel Stereo amp with A10 was simply amazing. MQA is in its full glory.....
Bluesound Vault 2 demo was very disappointing....$500 PSB monitors with NAD classic series components.
Enjoyed the usual Nordost demo with Jeff Rowland and DCS DAC. I believe Nordost Tyr2 cables sits at the sweet spot and probably the best value compared to Valhalla and Odin.
Look out for MERGING NADAC stereo and multichannel player. I was totally surprised, both by sound and reasonable retail ($10k) from a Swiss brand.
Moon Audio stack with 780D DAC was also amazing, price of admission - $19K for DAC alone with MQA capability...ouch!
More to come. |
