Musetec (LKS) MH-DA005 DAC

@romazicon I was only quoting your statement. So you don't believe your own words?

"No one has ever found the 005 incompetent".

Maybe you would like to share with us why the 005 was not for you? If you ever bought one in the first place.

Lol, @lordmelton.  You are the master of hyperbole.  Hard to take anything you have to say seriously.  Such the fanboy.

"no one has EVER returned a 005 or even criticized it by finding anything lacking."

Quite the arrogant statement, @lordmelton .  I found the 005 to be a competent DAC but not for me and so I returned it.  

@yyzsantabarbara  Don't know why you're not hearing a difference. Maybe bypass your power conditioner and go straight into the wall.

What cable are you using into your Torus?

I just changed my power conditioner fuse to a Power House Zero 2 and have ordered SR Purples to upgrade everything else.

Amazing.

I have not been able to discern any difference with my power cords on any of my gear. I plug my cords into a Torus RM 15 and likely have good power coming into the house. I use the stock 005 cord on the 005.

I tried a few other not so exotic power cords on the 005 and was not convinced of any improvement. The most expensive one was a 20-year-old Virtual Dynamics power cord.

Changes to my interconnects and speaker cable were easy to hear. I use Audience AU24 SE XLR on the 005 and it was better than the other XLR's I had in the house.

I will upgrade my 2-channel speaker cables first and then consider a power cord for the 005. I know a lot of people say a power cord is a bigger deal, but it has not been the case for me.

@debjit_g Yes I'll be getting a 3 way LPS for my router, Android Box and possibly the LKS USB to I2s.

The Musetec was on USAudiomart for only 5 days and the asking price was $2900. As it sold rather quickly I’m guessing the asking price was met, or close; that’s just a guess. If so, that’s pretty good, I think. Many folks paid under $3000 for the DAC on sale.

@melm yes, I think that's a great resale value. Thanks to this thread :-) Anyway, the Holo May has a great resale value as well and sells quicker than the 005 did.

@debjit_g This isn't a regular black pvc cord it looks like a custom cord with custom plugs, quite fancy.

@lordmelton for any digital components, DACs, DDCs, music servers, the power supply is going to make the most of the difference and it can either make or break a system. If you are introducing the DDC in between the 005, you should seriously considering powering it with a good LPS to know its audio quality.

While I'm here is anyone using the free power cord that came with the 005?

It's absolute garbage, swap it out for immediate sonic improvements. Seriously it's only fit to use on a kettle.

all audio components, irrespective of their price, comes with garbage power cord. the only difference is with Pass amps where they at least provide a nice heavy 14awg one but off-coarse not to any audiophile standard :-)

@melm Yes Shenzhen sell the LPS for it but I'll just try it out with a wallwart first because I need to get a 2 or 3 way LPS to give me more plug space.

While I'm here is anyone using the free power cord that came with the 005?

It's absolute garbage, swap it out for immediate sonic improvements. Seriously it's only fit to use on a kettle.

@lordmelton 

They sold (or sell) a matching LPS for it.

@sirnui I'm just breaking in my Ediscreation, I got the Extreme Version with the Bybees.

It's inedible even just so far, two days only.

Just listening to Paradise Radio is addictive. Many times better with the Edis.

@melm Not doubting you but looks like the 005 inside. Anyway if it doesn't work out I'll find another use for it.

@lordmelton

That LKS unit is a very old model, even proceeding the LKS 003 IIRC. That and the Singxer were popular before the DAC makers brought the function on board. It cannot be as good as what you already have in the Musetec. But who knows?

@audioman58

As reported here earlier, Apos comes up first for some reason whenever Musetec is Googled. It’s been "out of stock" there for over a year.

@debjit_g

Very interesting, and thanks for the report. The Musetec was on USAudiomart for only 5 days and the asking price was $2900. As it sold rather quickly I’m guessing the asking price was met, or close; that’s just a guess. If so, that’s pretty good, I think. Many folks paid under $3000 for the DAC on sale.

The seller was pt999 who had a Holo May and posted his detailed comparison of the two DACs right here.  He said he was keeping the DAC, after first deciding to return it. His last and most detailed post is on 12-24-2021 at 1:49am, p. 7 if you’re sorting new first. He describes his audio system as a high sensitivity system built around Edgarhorns. In any event it’s a very useful data point for potential purchasers of either DAC, Holo or Musetec.

@melm Regarding USB I’m currently using a Crystal Clear Audio Magnum Opus ll USB

Which I bought off Audiogon. It’s a very good cable and it’s kept up with all the improvements I’ve made to my system.

However top of the heap seems to be Shunyata Omega USB, Final Touch Sinope USB, and the Z:Axis Reference USB, but not sure if this is available yet?

All these cables are $2-3k new and even if you can find used the discount won’t be great.

On paper the Final Touch Sinope looks the most promising it’s used almost exclusively by Aries Cerat DAC owners.

Couple of weeks ago I ordered this, It’s an Amanero board to I2s made by LKS so the RJ45 and HDMI wiring is the same as the 005.

$206 bucks shipped from Shenzhen Audio, thought it’s worth a try. Currently waiting for stock.

I see Apos  audio in Ca selling it for $3395

There was one 005 for sale in usaudiomart just a few days back. I asked the seller what DAC he preferred. He courteously replied that he preferred the Holo Audio May by a good margin. Most DACs in this price range are mostly system dependent. 005 seems like a great value and so are other DACs, like the Matrix Audio Element series which has an immaculate measurements. Like many, I have gone through a fair share of DACs (PS Audio DS, Denafrips Terminator, Lampizator A3 & B3, Matrix Audio Element X, Chord, Aqua and many more) and I strongly believe, there is no "one be it all" dac in the market today. I am pretty sure the 005 (or any dacs in these price range) is not going to turn my audio world upside down with my jaw dropped to the floor but it might just be a good last 2% better match in my system than my existing dac and this why I am curious to try one.

@twoleftears actually the Kinki studio integrated not only has a great value but it also has a phenomenal sound for its price. I had one. Once you start rolling the opamps, the integrated can perform well beyond expectation. You would be hard pressed to find one at this price range.

@car123
I have often recommended Audioquest Pearl as a good and safe USB cable. It’s a solid core cable. Solid core was first recommended to me for digital by a well-respected cable guru on another site. The Pearl is inexpensive, well enough made and, in my experience, does the spatial thing well. IMO it’s a great basic cable against which to test other cables. The Pearl, though, may not provide sufficient sparkle in the sound, for me, and I have been testing other cables against it myself, including one or two old cables in the closet. One never knows. The Audioquest line continues with solid core only and adds different amounts of silver coating all the way up to solid core silver, and it gets expensive. Amazon USA has a liberal return policy so you can try a cable pretty easily. Since there is no 5V current running through our cable we can concentrate entirely on how the digital signal is carried.

I found this discussion on USB cables quite valuable.  Perhaps you have seen it.

@twoleftears
You may be perfectly correct, though this DAC has hardly "hit the big time." No one has ever said this was the best DAC in the world, only that it represents value. The problem for many audiophiles is the lack of reliability of even the "professional" reviews, never mind the many amateurs. Stereophile, perhaps the best, has DACs ranging from $1406 to $30,000 on its A+ list. It’s ridiculous. Do you remember what the A+ list was defined to be initially? I, for one, read the reviews principally to find out what the physical product is. I then dig deeper, if possible, to find out what’s inside the component for it cannot give more than it has. My best purchase decisions, though, were made by looking for lots of user comments, just like those here.

As you can see this thread has been populated principally by owners who have purchased subsequent to the start of the thread. Many have integrated the DAC into very high quality audio systems. I continue to be astonished at the thread’s growth.

@audioman58 Hi, How you doing? It would be great if you did a shoot out with the 005.

We should have the final results in soon against the Mola Mola.

I'm sure you'd appreciate the 005.

BTW see you're into the Final Touch cables. I'd be very interested to get some info on them.

I would like to see how it measure up the the latest $4600 Denafrips Terminator -2 

this is one of the best dacs out there under $10 k which is getting a lot of good press and I personally bought ,and now has U.S repair facilities if needed which BTW is rare and at 42 lbs with its separate separate o core transformers ,Linear power supplies,and super caps in a R2R design  with Dual over controlled clocks 🕰 of the very high order. 
 

Another, sort of affordable gear combo is the following:

Schitt Freya+ preamp (now sold)

Musetec 005

Benchmark AHB2 amp

I was amazed at how good this combo was on both my SR1a headphones and KEF LS50 speakers. When I replaced the 005 with the Benchmark DAC3B the SR1a became fatiguing.

@sirnui I bough the DAC3 HGC 2 times and the DAC3B 2 times. I think each time was to raise funds for something else. Anyways, I am not selling the DAC3B I have left.

My feeling is that the HPA4 or LA4 would be incredible with the 005. I have not tried it yet, but I believe your findings. I have a CODA 07x preamp and the LA4 preamp. I like the LA4 preamp more with my 2 channel speakers and the 07x with my headphones. It is a close call with those 2 but the LA4 (HPA4) are so quiet.

I also had the Topping pre90. I sold my HPA4 (to raise funds) thinking I could get away with using it. The pre90 only worked with a Benchmark AHB2 amp and Parasound A21+ amp. All other amps I used with it were too ’hot’ on the volume. Big mistake selling the HPA4 since I ended up getting the LA4 and sold the pre90.

A final point. I like my LA4 premp with my CODA #8 amp even more than the CODA 07x preamp (on speakers). I do not use it this way but that combo is great.

@yyzsantabarbara 

I think I understand what you mean about matching warm electronics with the DAC3 and preferring that matching over the 005.  I just sold my DAC3 DX recently. Believe it or not, it's the 4th DAC3 I've sold over the years.  I'm going to miss that sound because that DAC has been at the heart of audio journey for many years but it simpy was not getting playtime. It has found a better home.  I wish I can keep them all but I have to draw the line somewhere with the components I own.

The only Benchmark product I still have is the HPA4. I thought about replacing it with the Ferrum Oor/Hypsos stack but I found that the HPA4 is a great preamp to the Ferrum stack.  I find the combo of 005 > HPA4> Ferrum Stack to be amazing. It is the best sound I've ever heard with these ears.  I can hear the strengths of each component come through the music.  I also have a Topping Pre90 in house as well to compare preamp duties against the HPA4. So far, the HPA4 is clearly better for the job. I will let the Pre90 burn in more before I make final jugement.  Of course, I would love for the Pre90 to win so then I can free up funds for other things things :). I'm playing with the ratios again. 

I prefer the 005 over the DAC3B in almost all cases. However, if I had very warm speaker and other warm electronics then I could see myself going with the DAC3 over the 005.

I recently demoed a RAAL VM-1a tube headphone amp with the RAAL SR1a headphones at the dealer. The amp has some warmth, the headphones do not, and the combo sounds incredible. The Benchmark DAC3L was used in the demo. I did not have time to put in my personal 005 into the mix (it was sitting right beside the DAC3L) but the DAC3L was so perfect with that warm amp.

What that means is that I can buy a second Musetec 005 to replace my DAC3B in the Living room (all -Benchmark stack). The DAC3B will move to my VM-1a headphone only system.

In a previous post, I mentioned the Ediscreation Fiber Box II (Standard Version).  I would like to share some of my initial notes of the Fiber Box II after it was inserted into my Grimm MU1 and Musetec 005 digital front end.  The signal path is now secondary mesh router > Fiber Box II > Paul Pang Quad Switch > ENO Ethernet Filter > MU1 > 005.

The notes:

• better command of when sounds start and stop
• more bass bloom
• more nuances
• more relaxed
• better resolution
• more "meat and garnishments"
• better PRAT
• closer to the stage
• superb imaging

I do extensive research before I buy any audio gear and finding reviews for the Fiber Box II was hard to come by.  The Fiber Box II like the 005 is not greatly advertised but they are both hidden gems and value kings for what they bring to the table.  If your system already has optical isolation with OCXO clocking, then the benefit for you is likely different.

Speaking of value, when I compare two like things that perform similarly, I try to think of things in ratios.  If two DACs have similar sonic performance but one costs 3 times more than the other, then of course the ratio is 3 to 1.  With a ratio like 3 to 1 or 2 to 1, there is no contest for which DAC or component I'm going to choose.  Even if the cheaper DAC is slightly less pleasing sonically, I know I can easily make up that difference with cables or other upgrades and still have funds to spare. 

I'm not married to any of my component.  If I can get the performance of the 005 at half price, the 005 would be gone in a few weeks.  With that said, I don't think I will face this dilemma any time soon.  The Benchmark DAC3 at about $2000 is a possible 005 slayer because for me it has slayed a $6500 DAC but I've done my head to head comparisons and we know which DAC won the contest.

True, but quite frankly this DAC blows me away.  Granted, my last DAC was a dinosaur, but it was a good dinosaur.  Analog has been my thing for a long while and I know good sound.  I've bought so many "class A" and unqualifiedly spectacularly reviewed products that I was disappointed in and sold off that I am very jaded.  But this DAC is flat out spectacular both streaming through USB and redbook through coax.    

It's not as if there's ever been another thread on Audiogon where a little-known product had suddenly and spectacularly hit the big time (cough, Kinki), and then after a couple of months subsided again with the advent of a more cool-headed estimate of its strengths and flaws.

Melm, I can understand lemonhaze's use of if. There is a lot of hype out there these days, understandable that one may have doubts and or cynicism  in a general sense. We shouldn't be overly sensitive to those questioning this dac, being so only invites others to attack 005 users as fanboys. As for me, I feel self assured in my assesment of this dac, I've been around the block with audio, heard many multiples of $10k-even $100K systems over the years. I know what I hear, and feel confident this dac will hold its own against far more expensive dacs. Not saying it's best $10K or less dac, and/or only good value dac out there.

I'm just saying lets be positive here, being defensive only serves to undermine the wish that others give this dac a fair shake.

@balja Providing quality power to 005, and all components for that matter is important for extracting full potential.

@jriggy  My take on those other dacs conforms to yours. Comparing usb to other inputs on 005 or most any other dac is generally like comparing apples to oranges. Usb users will generally be streamers, other inputs generally cd transports so not directly comparible. Still, I'd assume all inputs on 005 would give you fair taste of flavor or capabilities of dac, perhaps not it's full potential.  What's most interesting to me about 005 is the difficulty of obtaining the full potential of it's resolving capabilities, never encountered prior in any source component. I'm completely out of possible upgrades and mods to my entire system, and the last mod I made wes easily exposed by 005.

@lemonhaze 
When someone says "if it performs as described" seems to me a clear suggestion that perhaps it does not.  You don't need a question mark to question what's been written here.  And, of course you're free to trust or distrust, as you say.  That's all I care to say on that.

And it is not "my" thread.  One loses ownership as soon as it's posted and threads usually go their own way.  It's just that as the OP I get emailed when there is a post and there's often a question I can respond to.

So let's both have a good rest of the day.  

Cheers.

I want to greet all the owners of 005. I've been listening to my Musetec since Christmas. Any change can be heard with it, such as the effect of silver-plated or copper power cables on cold or warm exposure. I got used to the fact that the sound of individual instruments overlap, while it is rich and detailed. I power my set via a 3,2kW isolating transformer with filters. I want to share my new experience with the power filter. 005 itself does not have a filter and it is possible that it has a reason. Out of curiosity, I made an experiment and temporarily connected the power filter to the power supply. For the first time it was Schaffner FN261-2-06 (+ 3.15A ceramic fuse). I did not notice any improvement or deterioration. The second time I tried the mains filter Schaffner FN 9260-1-06 (+ 2x fuse F 2.5A inside twisted wire). In this case, there has been a great separation and refinement of the individual tools, and more air has been added between the tools and there is no overlap at all. I had to add in volume. I don't want to rate what is better, but at the moment I prefer to listen with a filter. It's an interesting experience that I want to share with you and since there are a lot of types of power filters, fuses and also different sets, there will be a lot of solutions with different results :-) If someone likes holographic placement, this is the way to go. Curious be careful - dangerous tension! Jan

@melm, I think you need to relax a little. I am free to trust or distrust whomever I wish yet I have not uttered any derogatory comment nor cast any aspersions on 'your' thread.

Do you have any reason to distrust a good number of listeners like yourself?

You assume too much.

you're probably dreaming about a perfect world

This makes no sense to me.

I came here asking an innocent question because I trusted the positive comments, think about it!  Why are you getting bent out of shape over me using the word 'if' ?

There is no ? at the end of my sentence, read it again. It was a statement not a question!

@melm as you have said so many times my friend, no one has EVER returned a 005 or even criticized it by finding anything lacking.

I really don't know why a lot of people find it so difficult to comprehend that here exists a bargain that seems to have been created by Chinese people that love music.

Most Westerners look down on Chinese products and believe they can't outperform what the West churns out. Well the over hyped stuff from Weiss, dCS et al has had it's day, save for the crusty scroats that insist that dollars equal audiophile reproduction.

This DAC allowed me to spend $$$ on cables which would have been a stretch if I'd spent $10k+ on a DAC.

Still most of it's components are imported.

I don't see this DAC as the Chinese want to take over the World DAC. I see it as what enthusiastic audiophiles from China have created at a great price.

It's not a Topping or whatever, it has been created with the upmost attention to detail.

BTW AES/EBU is great but DSD needs USB for whoever asked.

FACT - Hong Kong prices of Western DACs have never been lower. If you don't believe me check it out.

@lemonhaze 
You write: "the apparently amazing 005 which if it performs as described is at an equally amazing price."

I have to inquire why there's an "if" there.  Why would you think that the DAC does not "perform as described."  Do you have any reason to distrust a good number of listeners like yourself?

I can give you five reasons why the sum of what you will find here about the DAC, written by actual purchasers/users, is more reliable than any review by what you would call a "reviewer."

As for comparisons of the $3200 Musetec to the $5500 Merason or the $6000 SW1X or the $7500 Mojo Mystique, you're probably dreaming about a perfect world.  It's already been compared to the Holo May, the Mola Mola Tambaqi, Chord Hugo 2 with M Scaler and a host of DACs that it has replaced.  Apparently it will soon be compared to the Bricasti.

Has anyone used the AES/EBU input exclusively OR enough to know how it fares against the units ‘best’ input, which I’m assuming is the USB, since the majority of comments are with USB. But what about the XLR with a nice cable and nice transport? 

@lemonhaze as much as the DACs you mention may all consecrate on sound over features, from what I’ve read, they’ve all be described differently. Very smooth and bit of warmth with big bass for the Mojo, a healthy chunk of warmth but good detail balancing with the Merason, and a bunch of tubes for SW1X. The 005 neutral and ‘exciting’, to be very general with all… I can see the Merason and Mojo DACs maybe being comparable, going by their general descriptions, but the 005 reads quite different from forum descriptions. 
 

DAC designers focused on USB that take advantage of the newest processors in their boards have taken this input to an exceptional level. Realizing bits are not just bits a good designer will render bit perfect processing regardless of the imperfect signal arriving. They will also cancel out any voltage carried.

After owning a HOLO DAC for 5 months I've come to appreciate the as good as it gets processing of USB signal. After a month of using this DAC, the cable experiment started. I apply changes for a month then revert to prior setup before accepting change as an improvement. Long story short is my system and this DAC took signal from any distance with any USB (limited to 1k, so not really any) cable quality I threw at it and never wavered. 

The really exciting feature is how 16/44k sounds when played. I use ROON and immediately appreciate when this format comes up. There is something remarkable about the original format that shines through when the signal path conversion is kept as close to native as possible. I'm not saying crap recordings sound great, they still sound like crap, it's the better ones that will amaze. I would recommend any DAC with a design focus on the USB input. Of Course, YMMV.

This is a great thread and I've read with mounting excitement/interest about the apparently amazing 005 which if it performs as described is at an equally amazing price.

I see the Merason DAC mentioned, which together with the SW1X and Mojo Mystique have my interest and now also the Musetec 005 (thanks to this thread)  It would be great if anybody could compare any of these other DACs to his 005.  All the DACs seem to be seriously focused on the resultant sound rather than features and being jack of all trades.

My DAC is really settling in and becoming very consistent and very smooth and detailed.  I've run it and the cardas usb for about 100 hours over the past week.   My streaming setup has been sounding excellent with an occasional seemingly recording related bit of excess high frequency energy.  Just for kicks this morning, I substituted an AQ pearl USB in place of the cardas and whoah, it seems to really balance and smooth the occasional high frequency tizziness I've been experiencing.  I'll run it a bit longer and see if this impression holds. 

We all know system synergy matters, not component cost.

It was a bit late last night when I made the Oversampling / Up-sampling comments.

Just so everyone is on the same page an Oversampling DAC Over-samples and then Down samples internally. So 44.1 kHz could be Over-sampled to 88.2 kHz internally and then Down-sampled back to it's original frequency, 44.1 kHz.

This is supposed to help reduce hash, noise and grunge etc.

Up-sampling is increasing the sample rate manually eg 44.1 kHz to 192 kHz or whatever.

HQ Player seems to be the current leader in Up-sampling tech but since I don't use a computer for audio I can't use it AFAIK.

What I like doing (because I only listen to old stuff) is increasing the resolution of my system to extract more details from old recordings that I've listened to 1000's of times.

It seems that some are confusing  "over sampling"  with "upsampling".   They are entirely different processes.  A NOS (Non over sampling) DAC can still be designed to "upsample".

@sns 

I look forward to your listening comparison of good quality 16/44 and upsampled digital  playback.

Charles 

There is a distinction to be made with playback vs recording in hi res digital. Every one of my listening sessions includes both original digital and analog mastered recordings, so we're talking all recording from sometime in 80's back all being analog, 80's-90's a mix, 2000's pretty much all digital. If I'm going to generalize, I find analog mastered recordings more natural, analog like. Digital mastered generally less of this analog like nature. But then there are the standout digital mastered and analog remasters in either redbook or hi res that are superior to almost any analog mastered redbook NON-REMASTERED recording. For the analog masters this suggests the remastering responsible for sq improvement, rather than hi res aspect. As I mentioned previously, I can't say I can confidently determine sq difference between these 16/44 vs hi res remastered analog recordings. So then we come to these superior digitally mastered recordings, both 16/44 and hi res. These easily compete and sometimes exceed the best analog remasters, I hear wider freq. response, superior micro and macro dynamics, an ease and even luxurious sense of vinyl playback that I don't quite get with the best analog masters.

The main issue I hear with most contemporary digital recordings is well documented dynamic limitations. This became salient during last nights listening session, very nice analog master and remastered recordings, then going to some modern recordings, clearly heard loss of MICRO DYNAMICS, not so much the macro, but this loss made me not want to listen anymore of these type recordings. Micro dynamics is where the life of the performance lives, take this away and you have mere sound reproduction, no illusion of performers in room. No amount of dsp or hi res can bring back whats been lost in mastering process.

So, assuming we can't bring back what is lost in mastering via hi res or dsp. How about these superior recordings, how can dsp improve upon the superior master? If mastering is wonderful, why would I want to add something to an already wonderful recipe, I'm as likely to ruin it as improve it. If the dac and system sans dsp are interpreting master recording as intended there should be no need for dsp. So, I can understand there are recordings that could use some massaging, the engineer and/or producer may have created a recipe that could be improved upon. In this case I can understand the judicious use of dsp, the problem with using dsp is that the same dsp settings are set universally, that setting may be perfect for one recording, not so good for another. DSP that could be applied uniquely to each recording could be useful, how to implement this? So, to my way of thinking, dsp is useful only for system limitations. I suggest the best we can do is having a dac with global sound qualities in alignment with our preferences.

AFAIK the 005 is NOS

If 005 works primarily in NOS mode, then one might try myriads of HqP filter/modulator combo to see if they like the sound of it. It all depends on personal taste - some like, some just don't.

and there is no facility in the software for up-sampling.

what I meant is up-sampling externally in s/w, like HqP or Roon.

However the Denafrips does up-sample even in NOS mode, there's something I saw on YT about it.

yes, that correct. However, there is a big difference between engaging the nos/os mode. I had the original Terminator and the difference between these two modes is quiet significant, depending how revealing rest of your system is.

@debjit_g AFAIK the 005 is NOS and there is no facility in the software for up-sampling.

However the Denafrips does up-sample even in NOS mode, there's something I saw on YT about it.

Up-sampling externally from s/w, like hqplayer, is only helpful when the DAC can work in a NOS mode (non over-sampling), otherwise the sound quality is mostly determined by the SRC within the DAC itself. Good candidates for nos DACs are  T+A, Holo Audio, Denafrips and this is why so many folks use HqP with these DACs. Not sure if the 005 has a nos mode as well. 

IMO we now have such a magnitude of processing capability on tap that up-sampling is no longer necessary and I concur with @sns  that resolving systems don’t benefit much or at all from up-sampling.

When all is said and done up-sampling is fake, it’s like wearing a fake Rolex. Maybe everyone else believes it’s real but you know it’s fake.

The only up-sampling I thought was good was up-sampling to DSD but that was some time ago and the Musetec doesn’t need it.

@melm I hope to explore this very soon via an acquaintance building serious  server dedicated to running highest level dsp with HQPlayer. I can only say my explorations with Roon dsp have been disappointing at best, I hear an 'electronic haze' or less natural analog like sound quality with any dsp engaged, even allowing Roon to control volume is bothersome for me. My experience points to 005 does better job with these digital processes than Roon, the rest of my system exposes those differences.

At this point not convinced of value of software dsp, typically I see great amounts of dsp used with desktop type systems. Go over to Headfi and lots swear by it, don't see it so much in high end systems. Perhaps lower quality dacs benefit more than the better dacs. It doesn't say much for one's dac if software dsp superior to letting dac control these processes. Why have a good dac if you're not using it's full capabilities? Also, it may be that only extremely transparent, resolving systems painstakingly  optimized for maximum analog like sound from digital will expose software dsp anomalies. Still, it may be that us older guys with high end systems are simply ignorant, more resistant to newer technologies. Expect I will soon uncover more knowledge with direct experience.

@melm

 But advocates of upsampling claim that even the finest mastered 16/44 files can have their SQ enhanced even more.  HQPlayer, for one, has built a business on that proposition.

Yes I'm very aware of those who hold this opinion (And those who do not). I haven't been committed to a deep delve to determine the proposed superiority of upsampling .

My only point was to acknowledge just how superb 16/44 Redbook CD can sound when one assembles a thoughtful system consisting of high quality digital hardware. Hardware in my observation has been the major bottleneck in exploiting the full potential of this format. 

Charles 

@sns 
The 9028 chip is also used in the Benchmark DAC3 I think.  It's one of the more popular DACs

@sns
@charles1dad 
What I had suggested is, with a given the level of mastering, users of the various Red Book (and even DSD) upscalings of programs like Audirvana and HQPlayer claim an increase of SQ.  The explanation is that some steps of the Sigma-Delta process are taken over from the DAC by the higher power computer with a beneficial effect.  So the mastering counts, of course.  But advocates of upsampling claim that even the finest mastered 16/44 files can have their SQ enhanced even more.  HQPlayer, for one, has built a business on that proposition.