Sop1 - here's another possible GOTCHA!
Beware of 12V AC power supplies that use an "electronic transformer"
When I was looking for a transformer I came across these "electronic transformers" used in 12v halogen lighting and discovered they may not give you a perfect sine wave and could cause problems in the DAC.
Much like a DAC assembling the audio signal, they build the sine wave, but the applications they are intended for do not require a perfect sine wave, so they don't bother to try!
The other problem is they might not handle the instantaneous peaks required in analogue audio, i.e. like a good old iron cored transformer would!
So the DAC would sound like CR*&!
If you are not a DIYer the Pangea is the best option I have seen at present.
Let me know if you see something else |
Williewonka - thanks for the correction, I missed the point that the Pyramid PS does not do both AC and DC like the Pangea P100. I read some good reviews about using it with the V-DAC and when I saw it was $23 instead of $100 went brain dead. |
Sop1 - the Pyramid PS3Kx appears to be a 12v DC and the original Dacmagic is 12v AC - so they are NOT compatible. However, the new Dacmagic Plus is 12v DC - according to the user manual on the CA website, so it is compatible How well it works depends on the build quality of the transformer and rectifier in the power supply (there is a huge variance across power supplies) and how much noise it introduces. The cable you use to hook it up is extremely important. I started using some 14 awg speaker cable, then changed to Kimber speaker wire - very high quality copper - amazing difference in sound! You may experience some humming from the actual power supply unit, since $30 would only buy you a pretty basic transformer which tend to hum at the mains frequncy. But, I did run run mine for a couple of months with a basic transformer (not the one you mentioned) and the hum did not get through to the analogue sound circuits. I purchased these DC connectors from Ebay, which worked extremely well on mine. They grip the cable like a vice! http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150602258980They took about a week to arrive. |
Magfan - Be aware that the new Dacmagic Plus is 12v DC and not 12v AC, so you cannot use the same power supply as the original Dacmagic.
Other than that it is an impressive spec. |
NEW DACMagic Plus is now almost out. Shown at CES, according to my local CA folks.
Adds headphone out and vol. control. Vol control can ALSO go to outs which are still balanced and unbalanced.
Can you say minimum system?
New DACMagic also has an input for a BlueTooth dongle for use in a BlueTooth system!
Add the Async USB input, 2 channels of optical/coax, the selectible filters and how could you miss?
I'm seriously going to check this out. |
Anyone tried the Pyramid PS3Kx power supply with the Dacmagic? I'm reading it works great with V-Dac. |
Not Really - better cable - better sound!
Rat Shack speaker cable is not great quality
your battery is a very stable DC supply (no waveform distortions), providing it has the capacity to deliver the required current peaks it will sound better.
DC supplies are quite different form AC supplies - they have to have a stable DC voltage AND be able to supply instant demands for current.
Try the Mogami with the battery it will be even better
The Mogami - provided the ability to supply the instant current requirements that the Rat Shack could not.
Try a bigger battery for even better results
My Kimber leads are amazing - very dynamic! |
I got a regulated power supply for my Apogee Mini-DAC and made up a connecting cable from leftover Rat Shack speaker wire. Sound turned out not as good as my battery supply. A bit harsh and edgy.
I made up a second 12V cable using cryo-treated Mogami quad-core. This new cable made the sound with the regulated PS just as good as the sound with the battery.
Weird huh? |
Well - I'm in the process of building my Mk II power supply and I was looking for a really good "screened" cable for the 12V AC to the Dacmagic (and the 640p).
Trouble is the good copper leads are too heavy a gauge for the little DC connectors!
Then I though about the braided power cables and how their geometry deals with RF very effectively.
THOUGHT: Hey! - Kimber makes braided cable!
So I purchased 3 ft of their smallest gauge (of cheapest line) speaker cable and fitted the connectors - Voila!
NOTE:- This works because it's ONLY 12V
DO NOT TRY THIS WITH A 120V CORD!
Now I know the "Power Cord Debate" rages across AG, but all I can say is...
H__O_L_Y______C_O_W !!!..... OK, so it was a more like BL**** H***!
HUGE 3D sound stage, incredible details, pinpoint accuracy (NO! - I mean PINPOINT) and amazing natural sound.
But get this - as soon as I turned it on! NO WARM UP!
Just how good can the Dacmagic get?
ABSOLUTELY BRILLIANT! Best $400 I've ever spent!
FYI - the MK II Power Supply will have 2 toroid transformers (Dacmagic + 640P) and vastly upgraded wiring and connectors in a single case.
This is one upgrade I am really looking forward to :-))) |
According to a discussion I just had with Audio Advisor, the P100 will work with the "plus" as soon as they get a cable that fits (none of the supplied cables work because of a larger center pin on the "plus" PS input). So there. |
The original DACMagic is designed for 12 volt DC also. At least that's what it says on the PS input. |
Look what they've done to the DAC Magic Plus
Changed the damn Power supply to 12v DC!!!
What a PITA!
I won't be getting one of those any time soon
Still I do have enough room in my new power supply case to add a rectifier bridge later on I suppose.
You can buy 12V DC supplies pretty cheap, but getting perfect DC with no rippling will be the challenge
Have to wait for Pangea to come up with changes to their P100 |
HA...yeah...I wonder if the P100 will work with the "plus", but I'm in no hurry to swap out my now "classic" DACMagic. |
Especially if they have upgraded the power supply! |
I predict the DACMagic plus will get RAVE reviews over the next couple of months and it will eventually be on every "best of 2012" list. Watch. |
They are available in Canada - and I'm tempted, but I'll wait for the 768kHz up-sampling version.
It will probably take them around 3 years to bring out the next gen with some really significant improvement
Or perhaps they will update the streaming technology on their DVD players so I can have a single unit to also replace my Dacmagic, Apple TV and CD player
Their BR players have some of this but lack the Internet streaming at present that the apple TV provides. |
The "plus" supposedly will be in the US later this month. |
CA have just released the Dacmagic Plus
- 24bit/384kHz upsampling
- Audio File Play via Bluetooth
- Volume Control
- Headphone jack |
I bought another P100 for my 640P phono preamp...I love those damned things. Seems to make the 640P warmer and more accurate...or something...and having 2 P100s next to each other in the back of my rack looks like the headlights in some space vehicle that landed there. A nice, somewhat mysterious vibe. Combined with the red filter I stuck on my Littlite, there is now a more serious red/blue theme happening...holiday appropriate! |
I'm really enjoying the DacMagic especially now with the Pangea P100 power supply. I can't solder to save my life so the $100 for the P100 Power Supply from Audioadvisor was worth it to me. |
The Squeezebox Touch has it's own sound...sort of sweet and "lower middy", but altogether not bad. In my compulsive quest for the cheapest possible upgrades I discovered that used DACMagics are around $300, and meet my needs for balanced outs and multiple ins (for Squeezebox and CD digital coax outs). Happily it made a LARGE improvement over the 'Touch alone (more coherant, sweeter, more accurate seemingly), makes my old but well designed Marantz CD player (a sturdy "changer" actually...NOBODY talks about those) sing, and added 3 blue lights! Might have something to do with the "re-clocking jitter reduction", upsampling, and better dacs/filters. The 'Touch lands the fish and the DACMagic cleans it. The P100 is sort of a calming presence except for the blindingly bright LED. FYI, the DACMagic "plus" comes to the US later this month, and looks way cool. |
Great information, thanks. For those of you who use a Squeezebox Touch were you able to hear the difference of the Touch DAC vs. routing through the DAC Magic before the PS upgrade? How did the upgrade effect the sound? |
It may be that the P100 noise filtering in both directions is a major deal. The "faqs" section for the P100 at Audio Advisor has the best description yet of what the P100 is all about (conversation with the designer), and I just ordered another one for my 640P phono preamp. Hot running "wall wart" power supplies annoy me, but the P100 runs cool and is seemingly a bargain for what it does. |
Soundbit - RE: same outlet - there is not problem with this - actually it would be preferable to prevent the dreaded earth loops There is a taylor made ps from Pangea that is built for this type of upgrade - I would recommend their solution over the DIY one - since they are the pro's see http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=PGP100Even at $100 it will make you Dacmagic sing! Happy listening |
UPDATE: another AG member is using a ready made power supply http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=PGP100It's a bit moe expensive, but professionally made by a reputable power company If I had found out about this I would have gone this route simply because of the hassle soldering the silly little DC connector I like the look of this unit very much because they have tackled all of the problems and then some including noise filtering - something my solution does not I would advise going this route enjoy |
Wow! That is really fun news and a fun project. What are the model/part numbers of the parts? Any need for soldering? How about peak current? (I have all my audio devices plugged into the same 15A outlet.) |
Riley804 thought I should include the following to address concerns about messing with power supplies...
A piece of equipment will only draw the power it has been designed to draw - increasing the power rating of the supply will NOT affect this - increasing the voltage will!
e.g. In north america small appliances of different power ratings are all connected to the same power supply - which is generally rated at 15amps - my alarm/radio does not draw 15 amps - probably closer to 0.5 amps, but it is perfectly happy connected to a 15 amp service :-)
Also - if your power supply is rated at 1 amp then you assume that's all it will draw. if it draws more than 1 amp, then the power supply will overheat
Most ratings are continuous, but with hi-fi you have to be able to handle serious peaks in the music and if your power supply cannot do this then you get heat generated, which in turn, causes a whole host of other problems.
All I have done is provide a supply with a higher current rating so the equipment can now handle those peaks - that is all!
Another thing I found is that the CA power supplies were not very accurate - the phono supply measured 16+ volts and the DACMagic measured 14.5 volts
Also - the 22 gauge wire on their supply is no where near large enough to handle the continuous and more importantly peak current draw of this unit!
The new supply I am using measures 13 volts - which is much closer to the 12 volt spec
One thing I have found is that the DACMagic runs considerably cooler with the new power supply - and that is goodness for a unit of this power rating.
Why? - it is likely that the circuit is now getting the current is requires in order to operate as it was designed and is not in a continual state of "stress"
Using an underrated power supply to restrict performance, as appears to be this case, is very dangerous - a fire hazard!
Granted - CA does not want people messing with power supplies...
1. because most people have a complete lack of understanding regarding power ratings - an underrated supply becomes a fire hazard
2. the consequences of putting an incorrect type of supply on equipment would be damaging - The reason for my "WARNING"
They have a blanket policy - Don't mess with our supplies! - it's just so much simpler than an explanation!
What I cannot understand is why CA limits the electronics that has such great potential if properly supplied with power - probably cost related, but could be, they wanted to reign in the performance of this unit so it does not compete with their more expensive line. Guess what - it competes!
This unit is sounding far from stressed right now :-))
BTW - I would caution that you DO NOT try this unless you are adequately experienced - failing to take the proper precautions can lead to equipment failure or worse - FIRE!
Be careful if you are attempting this.
ALSO - because of its size (i.e. Small) connecting the DC Connecter plug required me to insulate the wires inside the plug cover with shrink-sleeve to prevent a short circuit - FATAL!
If you try this - you do so at your own risk!
Electricity is quite simple - unless you cock-it-up! |
NOW - MAKE IT SING - like a much more expensive unit !!!!
Before I start - make sure you read the WARNING!
OK - Had this unit for a while now and been happy with it - especially streaming via an Apple TV - better sound than my CD!
But I had noticed that the unit and power supply runs a little warm - that usually means it's being taxed a little.
So I started looking at upgrading the power supply, which is not easy since all third party units are generally DC and this requires AC!
Then I had a moment of enlightenment - LOW VOLTAGE LIGHTING!
They use a 12 volt supply - only thing is, the units you can buy (for the garden) have timer crap on them
WARNING: DO NOT - I repeat DO NOT use the latest "electronic transformers" being used in the lighting industry - because they may not produce a true SINE WAVE!
If you can find a proper electrical supply store you can buy IRON CORE lighting transformers - mine is rated 100VA and comes with a heavy steel enclosure approximately 3x6x2.5 inches.
You then need some 16 gauge copper wire and a DC connector (it;s what those little plugs are called). I also included an fuse in the 120v side
Whole thing cost about $50 + my time - but the difference in the details and soundstage was incredible.
Now I'm not sure why CA does not provide a larger power supply - it would cost them peanuts. guess they want to sell you higher end product
REPEAT WARNING: DO NOT - I repeat NO NOT use the latest "electronic transformers" being used in the lighting industry - because they may not produce a true SINE WAVE!
Torroidal transformers would be even better since they are more efficient and far less noisy
Yes, it hums a little, but once I placed some plastic foam under the cover and some rubber feet it was not detectable from my armchair.
This is by far the enhancement with the largest impact I have ever made - like stepping up to $5000 cd player.
Spacious sound, incredible imaging in 3D, amazing details never before heard
I used the power supply from the DACMAGIC on my CA 640p phono stage and guess what - similar improvements we attained!
Both these units needed... MORE POWER! |
I use my DACMAGIC with a Cambridge Audio 550C CD Player. I bought the DACMAGIC to upgrade an old NAD 541 unit, ¡but the NAD died suddenly!
After some months using the DacMagic, I think that the differences that the DAC may produce are subtle (using it with a good transport), these are more noticeable with human voices, then a lesser degree with acoustic instruments (like piano, guitar, ...). Then, the differences are much less noticeable, almost imperceptible when compared to electric instruments (like the rock music in general).
What I hear, especifically better with the combination 550C/DACMAGIC is simply more detail, more textures, better definition and enhanced image, and even I fell a more airy sound. In contrast to the 550C alone, I hear a thud sound, as if the speakers were covered by a thin pastic.
I need to clarify something: the Cambridge 550C is an excellent CD player, most people could live with the 550C very happy without an external DAC. I thank that sound of the 550C is better than my old died NAD 541 (if my listening memory don't lie to me, due to the fact that I wast not able to compare both CD players) |
I've had a bunch of Dacs now and for various reasons. These include Musical Fidelity x3 dac, PS Audio III, Grace M902 Chinese made Matrix, and now the DacMagic. Each has its own character and I mainly used them to play thourgh my computer set up but also tried it out in my main system that is all Simaudio with Wilson Sophia 1 speakers. I think the Dacmagic is the best value by far. My favorite remains the Grace M902 but I sold it since I don't used it much and I sold it to buy the Matrix and the Dacmagic and still have money left over. The musical fidelity was nice and warm but too many things need (power supply, cords) to sound good. The PS Audio was sold to get the Grace and I liked it as well but I think the DacMagic is second only the Grace. The Grace is much more analytical while being very dynamic and had excelelnt bass. The DacMagic is more lush and I don't mind it with the Wilson speakers. I mainly use it to upgrade the sound coming from my 500gb Apple TV. |
Hola,
I'm thinking about using a Dacmagic to run a Rotel RCD 991 AE. Does anyone have experience with this set up? Is the cd player already as good as I'm going to get? It's currently being played through a CA 840a via XLR cables.
I listen to vinyl about 95% of the time. I'm trying to bring some cds back from the dead. The dither on the Rotel has improved the sound/fatigue factor (especially compared to my old NAD 521BEE), but the warmth of vinyl still reigns supreme.
I'd like to be confident that the $400 leap is worthwhile. Eventually, I'd also like a Wadia dock to improve sound from the iPod for playlists during parties. However, the Wadia is another future purchase and is of secondary concern.
Thanks for any help,
T. |
KS- I'm using MA RS6 too. Driven by Naim Nait XS. Nice sounding speakers for small to medium size room. |
I have been using the Dacmagic for 6 months now and the sound is amazing.The instruments are well laid out in the music I listen to.I didnt find any difference between Min,steep and linear.My setup is imac(itunes) to airport express to optical out into Dacmagic .My speakers are MA RS6.For 399 this is definitely a terrific performance DAC.Going from a budget onkyo receiver I am pretty happy with dacmagic
Regards
KS |
I have been using my new Dacmagic for about a week. Probably have 20 hours on it. I leave it on 24/7.
Can you hear much difference between MIN Phase & Linear Phase filters? I definitely hear the Steep filter. I have been using the Linear filter for most of my listening.
Source is Squeezebox Duet. |
This is followup review and feedback on DacMagic, balanced XLR Cardas Quadlink 5C cables, MIT digital coaxial cable after a week or run-in for approx. 40 hours.
I observed the sound stage is getting smoother, warmer. Although the sound stage during the initial auditioning is clear and clarity, but i felt it's little bright, too transparent, too tight, i couldn't listen for long session music as it's hurting and stressing my ears.
Now, i am pleased that the combo between DAC, balanced XLR cables and digital coaxial cable has come to another stage where warmer, musical sound stage is finally presented. I wish the sound stage will further improve overtime as the DAC and cables are not yet full run-in which is at one third or one quarter of its run-in journey.
|
I just purchased the Dacmagic (will receive later this week). It will be used in conjunction with Squeezebox Duet and possibly an older CD changer. Looking forward to hearing the results. |
Got my CA DacMagic, first impression (no fully run-in yet), it delivers a wider, deeper and more dynamic soundstage, better clarity, i can hear different depth of music with ease, it provides a very good and clear 3D sound imaging especially at mid-range (vocal) frequencies. I tried them at both digital sources, i.e. CA 540C CD player and Squeezebox Classic.
I believe it would be more warmer and musical after full run-in. I am very satisfy with its performance though it's just the first time audition. |
I have the dacmagic hooked up via USB from a Dell notebook (Vista), running audioquest copperhead to a NAD c372. This is my 2nd system, used in the computer room. In the room I also have 2 universal dvd players that connect directly to the NAD, not via the dacmagic. This is because all the music I listen to is on the hard drive, and I have no reason to play CD via the dacmagic. I do play sacd and dvd-audio straight to the NAD in 2-channel, and those sound very good. I have tried both units via the dacmagic to play CD as a test, and it was an improvement over both units in CD playback, but not as good as listening from the hard drive.
Sometimes I take the notebook and dacmagic and connect to my main system to see how it sounds, and it sounds very good. But again, playing music from the hard drive.
I also have a CA 840C in my main system, and it's built in DAC is better than that of the dacmagic, but no surprise there.
However, even though the 840C is better sounding, if I had never heard the 840C I would have been satisfied using the dacmagic on the main system.
The dacmagic is a good unit, and beats hands down any outboard sound card I have tried with the notebook. I am very happy with the unit. Anyone with a PC with lots of music on it will like the upgrade over a sound card. BTW, all the music on the hard drive is in WAV format, either CD ripped to WAV, and a lot of vinly recorded to the hard drive in WAV. The latter works very well, and sounds much better than my CD's ripped to WAV. |
Well, I've been struggling to appreciate my Dacmagic, but I'm about ready to ditch it. It's OK, overall, and it does do certain things better then the dac in my cdp, but in my system, there's something in the midrange that irritates me. It's like an electronic sounding coloration, and I'm also hearing some sybilance. It may be subtle, but I think using Maggies makes it stand out. So far I've not been able to sit through a whole CD without changing back to my cdp's output. The unit is plenty broken in, and I've tried various cables, but no luck. It's all about system synergy, and in my rig, it's been a frustration, so far. I was really hoping adding the Dacmagic would be an upgrade, but's it's been a lateral move, at best.
Yeah, if your gonna add it to a cdp with a crap dac, you'll probably be pleased, but it all depends on what you have for comparason. |
Hello! i just acquired Dac Magic recently and mated this with an old cheap Marantz cc-3000 5 carousel for my 2nd system ( all s/s) and th result is good very satisfactory and few days ago just received a new Harmonic Technology Digital copper and even sounded better.Now i have to break it in the cable for the better.
You cant go wrong with Dac Magic....you hear the magic! |
Any new thoughts on the DAC Magic?
I recently upgraded my speakers to Ohm Micro Walsh Talls which are connected to a Parasound AVC-1800 and HCA-2205 amp. I find that my old Sony DVD player isn't quite cutting it in relation to the rest of the system.
I'm on the fence regarding Blu-Ray/SACD, and am thinking that committing to new formats isn't such a good idea for me if I can improve on redbook with a DAC. I listen exclusively in 2-channel anyway, and won't make the best use fancier formats.
Any further opinions on the DAC Magic would be great! |
I truely have come to grow fond of the Dacmagic. I previously was using a highly regarded SACD player that was several years old and I find the the Dacmagic to be a very notiable improvement with CD's. It is like moving from mid-hall to a front row seat at a concert. I understand that some may not like that presentation but I find it very pleasing. It has added improved dynamics, detail, and exitement to my music listening sessions. I think Dacmaigic is not given enough credit for everything it does accomplish. Possibly it should have been put in a fancier box, weight andded, and the price raised to $995.
just kidding of course, I'm greatful to Chambridge bringing such an accomplished product to the market at such an afordable price. Many can experience tuely fine sound that may not have been able to otherwise.
I am interested in some additional comparisons between Dacmagic and the Benchmark DAC1 if anyone has direct experience I would like to get additional feedback. I'm all fired up about audio again now.
|
I've had varying experiences with different transports with the DacMagic. On a very old Nak single disc player from a customer, the DacMagic made very little difference when I was expecting substantial difference. A Cambridge Audio 640C V2 was clearly superior to this old Nak player. But when a DacMagic was connected to a Cambridge 640C V2 as a transport, the DacMagic was definitely a notable improvement. So, based on that, a person would think that the DacMagic would blow away the Nak from its analog outs, but for some reason it didn't respond well to the Nak as a transport.
Other people here have had varying levels of improvements depending on the type of transport used. Regardless of what reviewers or others say, I trust my ears first. For me, I have definitely noticed sound quality differences with various transports and the DacMagic. |
So I can expect to get better sound from a differnt transport? After reading this months Stereophile I gave up hope of getting better sound with a better transport. |
Stevenbell, I was just correcting and clarifying. I know you were trying to be helpful, so don't take it personally. Sam Tellig was apparently wrong if that's what he said. The DacMagic uses dual Wolfson DACs (the same ones as the 740C) and the 840 C uses Analog Devices DACs, so I just wanted to correct your information. But I still hold to what I said that you can't say something sounds "identical" because they utilize the same DACs. Don't worry about it. |
Everest audio
The Dac's in the 840 are the same according to Stereophiles Sam Tellig. He even goes on to say the sound would be simalar between the Dacmagic and the 840.Take it up with him I was trying to be helpful. |
Stevenbell, the DACs in the DacMagic are not the same as in the 840C, they are the same as in the 740C. Even if they were the same, that by no means says that the sound is identical. The type of DACs used are just one aspect of the sound. There's a whole lot more to the overall sound quality than just the type of DAC that is used in the design. |
Drubin
The dacs in the Dacmagic are the same as in the Azur 840 so the sound is Identical. It wouldn't be an improvement. |
Try it with a Blu Ray player. It will take it up a level. Try the Stone's Shine a Light movie or the new Neil Young. |
I have had a DACMagic in my sytem for a while and have been very impressed by its performance. I run the digital out from my Squeezebox into one input and the digital out from my Sony player to another input for listening to RBCD. I also run USB directly from my music server from time to time, like when I'm previewing something over the web from eMusic or the like. Nice to have all of that flexibility!
Before the DACMagic, I was using a Musical Fidelity XDACv3 with both the XPSU external supply and the X10 tube buffer. I wanted to get something with switchable inputs, so the DACMagic seemed a good choice at a reasonable cost. Well, "reasonable cost" became an understatement once I got it hooked up. Much better transparency, air and imaging than the MF stuff (which I still think is very good). I think the DACMagic is a fantastic value and to get better sound, I'd probably have to bump up to something like the new Bryston or Bel Canto DAC3.
As far as setup, use good cables; I'm a big fan of PNF Audio and have both their Coax and Toslink cables on the DAC Magic and their interconnects on the output. Also, as stated previously, vibration control is always a good thing. I have the DACMagic sitting on three #2 Vibrapods and it does make an improvement in clarity and dynamics.
Ejoy the music!
|
