@ grannyring
No one is whining, to some people information is a key factor when making a purchase especially when a buyer is dropping $$$ on something they've never heard. Like you I appreciate a designer that takes pride in their product and taking the time to give some mandatory specs speaks volumes. It's the little things that show the designer looks at the little details that make a long lasting product. I've never heard the Dude, and I'm sure it sounds great, but there are many potential buyers who will immediately discount the product for lack of basic spec info.
I have some old gear that I've inherited from my father, hell he has some old gear that he still uses today; awesome build quality that's still going strong. These companies took pride in the little things and for me I expect that from any company that charges a high amount. |
Bill, I agree, but you do understand the power of marketing, don't you?
Some folks need to be told what to buy, they cannot trust their own ears. |
The VAC Signature is a wonderful piece and no concerns about the manufacturer. |
ITs not about marketting ploy BS we looking for, Just simple stuff like Spec or topology on preamp, Inputs, Outputs, Options available, coponents being used. Some pictures thats all. Few paragraph wont hurt or take away to much time and effort. Anyways Im not attacking TRL and have no intention to do so. I understand they are a 2 man company and the feller needs to make a liviing and probably does really make very fine pre which can stand against the big boys. I dont want to comment further. So im gona leave this topic alone and move on. |
John, I am in marketing and know the power well. |
Dragon vibe, I agree with you. A small two man company has nothing to do with it. Just look at Presence Audio or First Sound. Emanuel Go is a one man team and he has a nice website that shows specs, pictures, and describes the circuit. So yes it can and should be done. |
John, I am in marketing and know the power well. |
To Dragon's and other comments this is a joke for a product page http://www.tuberesearchlabs.com/products/dude.html |
"John, I am in marketing and know the power well."
Great. Then you also realize that the dearth of basic information on their website creates an aura, a mystique that can create a cult following.
Why do other smaller boutique shops disagree with that approach? I'm thinking of Audio Horizons, DeHavilland, and many others. |
Dragon,
Since you`ve eliminated the Dude from your list I can suggest three linestages based on personal experience.In no particular order.
1)VAC Signature MK II.
2)Atmssphere MP-1 MK III.
3)Coincident Statement Linestage.
All 3 are superb in sound,built quality and customer support.They are different in design and circuit yet these three I`d choose above the ARC REF V.Yes, just one man`s opinion.The VAC and Atmasphere you`d have to find used to come close(if possible) to your price point.But the three of them make simply beautiful music.
Good Luck, |
Hey guys, I say "to each his own." You wanna talk about webpages, take a look at CAT - Ken Stevens has made some of the most successful and best sounding preamps of the past 20-some years and they hardly have a website! You might want to add a CAT preamp to your list.
Buying from Paul with his less than techno-savvy website is not going to be for everyone, but maybe he wants it that way. Think about it, if he had a great website, a dealer network, and attended all the shows, perhaps he wouldn't be able to keep up with demand. In this commodity driven world I can appreciate that a design artisan might want to keep control of his work, and deal only with customers who really want and appreciate the products. If his current advertising program (or lack of) wasn't working for him, don't you think he would make changes? Same with Ken Stevens at CAT.
On the other side of the coin, it doesn't take a large company to have an up to date website. For example, Emmanuel Go at First Sound has a very nice modern website for what is basically a one-man operation with one basic product. Emmanuel also makes great sounding preamps that you might consider.
I don't disagree that Paul at TRL may benefit (with increased sales) by having better descriptions of his products on the website. I personally like the detail given the products on the First Sound site. He could also consider getting some outside assistance like Ken Stevens at CAT did with the Factory Tour Feature Article on Soundstage! But, even if he never upgrades his website, you have to respect all the positive feedback he receives from audiophiles who have actually purchased his products. I came really close to buying a DUDE a year or so ago but, like Jtwrace, my amps have only balanced inputs and, at the time, I was too impatient to wait for Paul to construct a new balanced model and, like you, I was hesitant to spend the money on something unheard. That was my choice, and probably my loss since several audio-aquaintances told me how great the DUDE sounds so, maybe in the future... I would still love to hear one in my system.
Finally, I wouldn't entirely give up on solid state. I still think the Tom Evans preamp approaches most of the good tubed preamps I have owned, although it is a bit more neutral and slightly less dynamic so maybe not for everyone. Currently I am using a great sounding custom preamp from another design artisan, Steve McCormack, who took an old TLC-1 and, with carte blanche authorization, crafted an amazing balanced preamp that rivals anything I have owned. Steve's website needs a little work too - but then, I don't listen to the website.
Good luck with your search. |
Your opinions are all great and nobody is trying to win or lose. This is not a matter of sides or right and wrong. To make it into that is unfortunate and disappointing. I buy based on hearing and reviews and comments from other seasoned, well respected Aphiles. I have learned a great deal from this site and purchased the Dude, Duelund caps and many other "under the radar" joys because of the combined experience of posters. I hope I have done this for others through the years.
I wish you all a Wonderful Christmas. God bless! |
I forgot to add, I have owned the Dodd and its a wonderful preamp - right up there with the VAC that I currently own. I owned mine a few years ago and had issues with the battery charging making the unit somewhat unreliable. It looks like the Dodd uses a new system now, but I would suggest researching that issue closely.
In fairness to the OP, let's drop the TRL debate. |
A pretty website and impressive specs don't guarantee a quality product or company. One must do his/her HOMEWORK before making any purchasing decisions. In a niche market, boutique companies are the norm rather than exception and if one is adventurous, they will be rewarded.
Like Mitch2 said, "to each his own" and it's ridiculous bashing a company for their website. |
For the sake of future argument I sent my last post midday yesterday, seems the site is slow in posting |
Westv12. I agree with you and love all of the service, advice and handling of the details I get with my small preamp builder. Priceless! |
It is rare for a craftman to also be a good businessman. Most craftsmen will be interested in getting the product right and not answering the phone/ emails and setting up a good website. Some will partner with a marketing person, but others are fine selling to a nich group of customers and keeping quality under control. I like working with craftsmen, and it will drive others crazy. You decide for yourself with your money.
Our company has opened 3 new offices in the past 4 years by word of mouth and providing good service. Believe it or not, this still works, and seems to be working at TRL and other small companies. People seem to respond to companies with craftsmen who love what they do, others need, and expect, more than that.
Btw, our website is a joke. We don't care. |
Emotive Audio preamps are excellent.
Epifania is top of line pre. But expensive.
Emotive Sira is also excellent. Cost less. In your price range. I have moded Sira and I can tell you-excellent pre. My best pre. Close to Epifania sound. |
If I were shopping for a preamp, sound would be my top priority but not my only priority. It might be a hobby; but it is still a business transaction. I do not rotate equipment very often but I still consider resale value to be very important. Maybe I plan to keep it for several years; but things change and I might want to sell it after just a year or two. Is it going to sell, or am I going to take a bath on the deal to get it off my hands? What about safety and reliability? Does this device have the UL and/or TUV seal? Would I feel safe leaving this device on overnight while I sleep or leaving it on while I am out shopping or at work all day? How will I get it serviced 10 years from now? Will the manufacturer still be in business or will I have to hunt down a tech who is able to service it? How will this tech know how to service it without the technical schematics or specs? How do I know my unit sounds as good as all of the others that this manufacturer has built? Perception is everything in marketing a product. I feel excellence is a state of mind. It must be pervasive throughout the organization whether it is a one man outfit or a large company. So I cannot buy into the idea that a shabby website has no connection to the quality of the product. Maybe I will miss out on a gem or two with this mindset; but I'd say the odds are still in my favor. The converse is not true either. I won't let myself be lulled into buying a product based on a top notch store front or website without first investigating my other priorities for a product. (I have sold an item or two online and I quickly learned that presentation has a big impact on the final auction price.) |
Tonywinsc,
You make some good points,there`s one I`ll take exception to.I see no correlation(at all) between web site quality and the quality of the product. The site can be "shabby"(not the wisest marketing decision)yet the product remains outstanding.
Regards, |
Dragon_Vibe, So far you've not mentioned what kind of amp you have other than it is solid state. Does it have a balanced input? Do you know the input impedance?
This might help a little in your search. Some preamps (ARC for example) don't seem to like it if the input impedance is less than about 20-30K ohms.
If your amp has a balanced input, its likely that it will sound better if the preamp is balanced. So if you are still looking for input, this information from you might be helpful ;) |
Ralph, note this statement in the OP's initial post: Amplifier: Audio GD Master 2 Series Mono Blocks (Will Upgrade Later to Krell, Macintosh or Pass) The Audio GD Master 2 is indicated as being a fully balanced design, with an XLR input impedance of 94K and sensitivity of 4V rms. It is rated at 250W into 8 ohms and 500W into 4 ohms. It only provides RCA inputs if they are custom ordered. Best regards, -- Al |
Ultimately, is a "craftsman's" ability to do what he does best really impacted by simply taking an hour or so to provide some modicum of detail that his customers can view, and thereby get better acquainted with his products? It would seem somewhat more practical to provide a degree of information than having to answer the same questions over and over via email or phone, and less time consuming. |
Tonywinsc, you bring up many very good questions, and each buyer will have to answer these to their own personal satisfaction. There are no absolute guarantees in life, and sometimes even big name high end companies go out of business, witness Counterpoint, Threshold, etc.
Yes, on average ARC, Krell, VAC, CJ, etc., may be a safer bet than TRL, Doshi, Messenger, Clayton, etc., but they are still a risk, especially when considering the risk/reward scenerio of a Sony/Denon/Marantz purchase. It's a lot like buying stock, you can buy a low risk, low reward stock or be more adventurous and roll the dice on a high risk, high reward stock. That's what makes life interesting, and many people will have many different views on what is right. It all boils down to what is right.....for you, the buyer.
Remember though that all of these high end audio companies are a bit riskier investment than say a Sony, Denon or Marantz. Most of us here gamble to some degree. The only difference is how high of a risk/reward gamble we are willing to take. |
Has anyone compared the BAT REX to the VAC Signiture?
I have already placed an order for the Dodd Audio Pre-amp Still need another pre-amp |
Has anyone compared the TRL dude to earlier designs like the two chasis GTRP-platinum (one listed in Australia right now)? |
