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Who needs a Diamond Cantilever...? 💍

So suddenly, there seems to be a trend for Uber-LOMC cartridges released with Diamond Cantilevers...😱
As if the High-End MC cartridges were not already overpriced....?!
Orofon have released the MC-ANNA-DIAMOND after previously releasing the Limited Edition MC-CENTURY...also with Diamond Cantilever.
Then there’s the KOETSU BLOODSTONE PLATINUM and DYNAVECTOR KARAT 17D2 and ZYX ULTIMATE DIAMOND and probably several more.

But way back in 1980....Sony released a Diamond-Cantilevered version of its fine XL-88 LOMC Cartridge.
Imaginatively....they named this model the XL-88D and, because it was the most expensive phono cartridge in the world (costing 7500DM which was more expensive than a Volkswagen at the time)....Sony, cleverly disguised this rare beast to look EXACTLY like its ’cheap’ brother with its complex hybrid cantilever of "special light metal held by a carbon-fibre pipe both being held again by a rigid aluminium pipe".
The DIAMOND CANTILEVER on the 88D however......was a thing of BEAUTY and technological achievement, being formed from ONE PIECE OF DIAMOND including the stylus 🤯🙏🏽

I’ve owned the XL-88 for many years and recently discovered that it was my best (and favourite) cartridge when mounted in the heavy Fidelity Research S-3 Headshell on the SAEC WE-8000/ST 12" Tonearm around my VICTOR TT-101 TURNTABLE.
Without knowing this in advance.....I would not have been prepared to bid the extraordinary prices (at a Japanese Auction Site) that these rare cartridges keep commanding.
To find one in such STUNNING CONDITION with virtually no visible wear was beyond my expectations 😃

So how does it sound.....?
Is there a difference to the standard XL-88?
Is the Diamond Cantilever worth the huge price differential?
Is the Pope a Catholic....?

This cartridge simply ’blows my mind’...which is hard to do when I’ve had over 80 cartridges on 10 different arms mounted on two different turntables 🤯
As Syntax said on another Thread:-
When you have 2 identical carts, one regular cantilever and the other one with diamond cantilever (Koetsu Stones for example), the one with diamond cantilever shows more details, is a bit sharper in focus and the soundstage is a bit deeper and wider. They can sound a bit more detailed overall with improved dynamics
I’ll leave it at that for the time being. I will soon upload to YouTube, the sound comparisons between the two Sony versions on my HEAR MY CARTRIDGES THREAD.

But now I’ve bought myself a nightmarish scenario.......
There is no replacement stylus for this cartridge!
There is no replacement cantilever for this cartridge!
Each time I play records with it, I am ’killing’ it a bit more 🥴😥
If I knew how long I had left to live......I could program my ’listening sessions’ 🤪
But failing this.....I can’t help but feel slightly uncomfortable listening to this amazing machine.
128x128halcro
chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
In my opinion it is much easier to compare different cantilevers on MM or MI cartridge inserts. In this situation the generator is the same, the difference is only a cantilever (sometimes stylus profile too). This is the reason why i like manufacturers who gave their customers almost all types of cantilevers to choose. Grace gave that option for advanced models, so anyone can try Aluminum, Beryllium, Boron, Sapphire, Ruby and even Ceramic cantilevers on the same cartridge. I think this is such a great option for curious people.

The situation is different with MC cartridges, but in addition to @nandric post above i would like to remind everyone that modern Miyajima MC cartridges are all comes with Aluminum cantilevers, even an exotic Madake cantilever is a mix of aluminum pipe and rare bamboo. The Miyajima-San claimed that his choice of cantilever material is based on actual sound of his cartridges and different cantilevers does not improved the sound. You will not find any Boron in Miyajima cartridges. I think the goal is patented Cross-Ring method which makes those cartridges so unique and highly regarded. Cartridge designeds mentioned by Nandric are all retired or dead, but Miyajima-San is alive and still making outstanding LOMC cartridges with Aluminum cantilever.
nandric's avatar
nandric
4,086 posts
 
Dear chakster, ''designers mentioned by Nandric are all retired or
dead''. Well Reto Andreoli just produced successor  of his Magic
Diamond while our former member Dertonarm is still going
strong. Ikeda passed away this year and produced two new
carts with aluminum cantilever two(?) years ago:  Ikeda 9 TT and 9TS.  You should update your (carts) encyclopedia (grin).
Promoting MM kinds in order to better compare cantilevers will
not work for me.  
nandric's avatar
nandric
4,086 posts
 
Parts and wholes. Our eloquent architect from Australia should
as such introduce this thread with some kind of, uh, introduction.
We all know that an building consist of ''parts'' but also that the
most look different while among them some are called ''artist''
and the other ''ordinary''. 
We have also heard this confusing ''explanation'' that the
whole is ''more'' than the number of parts  questioning our
''proven'' number theory. There is the aggregation method of
''putting parts'' together but also ''coalition'' or ''composition''.
Equal or similar parts can be put together as a heap and also
count like money. But ''composition'' can be best illustrated
with musical composer. Why can we hear differences between
Mozart , Bach, Wagner, etc. ?  Is an musical work ''distinct 
quality'' on its own? Such that we can separate one from the
other. Does this also apply for carts designers such that we
can hear differences between Ikeda and Van den Hul ,etc.?
There is also ''causal'' explanation versus reasons explanation.
The first assume some binary relation between cause ''a'' and
effect ''b'' while reasons can be more than two. Then there are
the old Aristetotelian ''essential'' and ''accidental'' properties of
objects. The ''essential'' assume a priori knowledge because
finding out what quality objects have is a function of time and
search.
So how should we deal  with one single part in the ''whole''
of an cartridge construction or ''composition''? 
By comparison between two ''identical carts'' with different
single part? (equal and ''identical'' are different animals)


chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
@nandric I have no idea who is Reto Andreoli (and our Dertonarm as a cartridge designer), but i respect japanese school of cartridge design from the masters like Takeda and Ikeda, at least i own some of their best cartridges. And yes, all with aluminum cantilever. Takeda’s last work was for 47 Labs before he retired. I don’t think Ikeda (R.I.P.) personally made any cartridges at his age in the past 10 years or so. But i am waiting for Ikeda IT-345 tonearm soon for the Miyajima Kansui cartridge (also with aluminum cantilever).
folkfreak's avatar
folkfreak
1,349 posts
 
@chakster by "dertonarm" Nandric means Dietrich Brakemeier of Acoustical Systems. All of his cartridges including the top of the range Palladian which @halcro and I both use have aluminium cantilevers and sound (to my ears at least) first rate. Considering his use of exotic materials in other aspects of these models I presume he's chosen Al for the cantilever as he believes this works best.

I believe dertonarm was the Audiogon ID Dietrich used to use when he hung out in these parts back in the day ...
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