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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
Hi Tas,
Well your conclusions about the Coincident speakers match mine. Very good cabinet construction, excellent quality drivers and pretty simple signal path. Address the crossover with premium parts and you'll have an exceptionally sounding speaker (natural rather than artificial Hifi). I'm very happy that you achieved such a pleasing outcome.

For the initial money spent on the superior parts the end result is actually quite a remarkable value. You can use any top quality source or preamp/ amplifier and your speakers won't be outclassed, they'll easily keep up!

I agree with, this long thread (thanks Volleyguy) has been informative, friendly and fun.
Charles,
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
Hi Bill (Grannyring),
As usual you raise many good points with your insight.Based on my experience I really can't understand why builders of expensive speakers don't use bette Xover parts.I sincerely respect their talents and efforts but many(not all) seem to cheap out on the Xover portion of the speaker.Or they design a complex multiple part Xover with poorer quality caps, wire and resistors. It seems to me that fewer parts (simple design) but placing emphasis on the quality would be a better option.

To Coincident's credit their Xovers are very simple and direct. The standard speaker is very good sounding. Yank out the Solens capacitor and insert Duelund and it's a "Wow what happened" experience.This would probably be true for the vast majority of speakers. Speakers with complex-multi capacitors can become expensive to change if you decide to go the Duelund route . fortunately there are other less costly alternatives that would still be a worthwhile upgrade from the stock parts.

I never would have thought that the Xover could be so crucial to the overall sound. Another example of "everything matters".
Charles,
jwm
918 posts
 
It seems the crucial part of audio is the xover and power supplies in all other components. Ok everyone get your soldering irons out.
grannyring's avatar
grannyring
6,526 posts
 
Jwm - Big Amen to that. Both the power supply statement and get out your solder guns!
audiolabyrinth's avatar
audiolabyrinth
4,555 posts
 
Thankyou volleyguy1 for your input, a very good explanation, and reading all that has been said recently was a great learning exsperience for me, citing that alot of well regarded exspensive speakers have poor implimented cross-overs was a revelation!, I do want all of you here to know, I am formost a believer most High-end speakers are way over priced period, I have wittnessed many times over a $2,000.00 to $5,000.00 speaker completly out perform $20,000.00 to much more exspensive speakers, there always seemed to be something missing in the sound to the more exspensive speakers, A higher cost to me does not always mean better when it comes to speakers, really, there are alot more speaker makers than anything made in audio, so there are more choices world-wide, thus, I believe why I was able to hear cheaper speakers out-perform the exspensive ones, so gentlemen, what all of you are stateing here is spot on with me, and what I enjoy, you are saying, you can take a very,very, good $2,000.00 speaker from 1992 and kick the crap out of most out there with all the cap up-grades for speakers mentioned in the last few post?, I was very supprised with the modest percentage ratio!, there is componets that do not do that,LOL!, what a learning exsperience here, cheers to all of you gentleman, By all means, carry on.
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