2. amps-preamps
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Clayton Audio Class A amps. Need amp advice

Hi Guys,

I am looking to change my amps and for a few reasons.

First because I just upgraded my DAC from the great PS Audio DirectStream to the incredible Bricasti M1 DSD USB DAC. I love the Bricasti and it has shown that in my system it could offer me more with a more resolving and neutral amp IMO.

I am currently am using the wonderful sounding CJ Premier 12 mono tube amps. I love them and tubes in general but my speakers are the great Ascendo C8 Renaissance and look to present a somewhat benign load being 88 efficient and 6ohm but they are unique and have an internal firing 21 cm Kevlar Bass driver that is great but stubborn and the speakers I think will really shine with a iron fist control of that driver.

I love tubes, always have and always will but I grown tires of a flabby bottom which is exasperated by a unique and somewhat difficult to grip bass driver set up I spoke about above.

I want an amp that can give me as much tube sound as possible but with Grip and bottom end. I know this is a lot to ask for in the used $5k to $7k price range.

I have read and it seem like the Clayton offer exactly what I am looking for but wanted to hear from some of you guys if anyone has ever heard them or know of them or anything. Any info would really be appreciated. Here is the info on my speakers and I will also list the rest of my system in case you think that is helpful. Thanks

C8 Renaissance
Technical Data
Principle
• Three-Way with SASB bass unit (TOS Off)
(current damped outer driver with semi symmetrical band pass)
• Four-Way with SASB bass unit (TOS On)
Dimensions (W/H/D)
• 28 / 80 / 40 (without Base)
• 28 / 108 / 40 (with Base)
Weight
35 kg
Frequency Range
29 Hz (-3 dB) – 32.000 Hz
Power Rating
350 W Program (min)
Impedance
6 Ohm
Sensivity
88 dB / 1W/m
Outer Chassis (COAX)
• 25 mm Neodymium-fabric-tweeter
• 18 cm Woofer with XP cone
Inner Chassis
• 21 cm Chassis, Kevlar cone
TOS Chassis
• Ribbon-tweeter
TOS Function
• switchable (TOS Unit - Dipole AN / AUS)
Sockets
• Single / BiWiring Base
Dimensions (W/H/D)
28 / 18 / 40 cm
Weight
11 kg

Ascendo C-8 Renaissance Speakers (Germany) Speaker
Purist Audio Design Corvus Praesto Revision 2.5m Bi-Wire Speaker cable
Darwin TRUTH Pure Silver Reference 1 Meter RCA Interconnect
Darwin TRUTH Pure Silver Reference 1 Meter RCA Interconnect
Bricasti M1 USB / DSD / Volume Control DAC (New) DA converter
Tellurium Q BLACK DIAMOND Reference USB Cable
Decware ZSTAGE External Triode Output StageTelefunken ECC801S
Audio Research REFERENCE 1 MK II w/Rhodium IEC/NOS Tubes Tube preamp
PS Audio PowerPlant Premier AC Regenerator
Conrad Johnson Premier 12 Mono's 140 Watts Tung-Sol KT120's Tube amp
Salamander Amplifier Stands (2) Synergy System AV Furniture Stand
BMI Shark Jeweler Grade Platinum 9 AWG AC Power Cable
Mad Scientist PC-NEO with Power Purifier 11 AWG Power Cable
Sablon Audio Petite Corona 2.0M 7 AWG AC Power Cable
JPS Labs The Power AC+ 2M 8 AWG AC Power Cable
Synergistic Research Labs Tesla Series SE T1 AC Power Cable
Synergistic Research Labs Tesla Series T1 AC Power Cable
PS Audio Noise Harvester (5) Converts noise to light
OYAIDE RI Beryllium Power Outlets (2)
Blue Circle Audio The Yalu Balula Industrial Surge/Spike Protection
JPLAY v5.2 hi-end audio player turns PC into a digital transport.
Fidelizer Pro Version 6.1
JRiver Media Center 19 Music Software
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fsmithjack OP
712 posts
 
Just listened to an older Krell KSA 200S amp.

Holly Smokes... Wow, I have never heard a Krell before. I thought they were cold and sterile and etched and fatiguing and flat and 2 dimensional and boring amps?

That's not what I heard at all. It had incredible control over the woofers like nothing I have ever heard and it sounds great. Smooth as can be, no etch or fatigue at all. If I had a complaint it would be that its maybe a little bit too dark sounding kinda like a BAT amp. Heck it has less bite than my CJ Tube amp and that says a ton. My CJ is the Premier 12 from old but not the too old school but still warm and romantic school.

Whats the deal here?? I really have a lot to learn about SS amps. They have a real bad rap out there. Anyone else hear this amp? Am I wrong? I think I like SS amps maybe ones just a little bit brighter and sunnier with a little more bite up top and 3d and i'm all in. Is that a Pass or a newer Krell or what?

I am kinda in no mans land here being a loyal tube guy that flabby bottom just got to me. I have never heard what a speaker sounds like when it is completely and utterly subordinate to the amp. The Krell grabs the speaker by its throat and throws it down and puts its boot on it neck and it is game over! Pretty cool, never heard that been busy in the land of warm and fuzzy with tubby bass but I would love to get an amp with bit more like a mentioned above with this type of muscle...

What do you guys think??? Any ideas...
soix
9,633 posts
 
What did you think of the S40? How did it compare to the Krell?
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
I think what has been discovered here is this, there are certain speakers that will perform their best when powered by solid-state amplifiers, conversely there are certain speaker designs that will sound better when powered by tube amplifiers.The particular design of a speaker and the intent of its designer has a lot to do with which type of amplifier will sound best with a particular speaker. In this instance it seems as though this particular speaker responds better to a solid-state amplifier, you could take that same Krell amplifier and use with another speaker and it would be disappointing, it just all depends. A good quality tube amplifier will not sound too warm, fuzzy and flabby if it's mated with the appropriate speaker.
sbank's avatar
sbank
3,379 posts
 
Frank, did you hear the Krell in your system? Charles raises the most important point: amp & speaker matching.

If so, how do compare the sound of the Krell vs the Clayton? If you heard the Krell w/different speakers, it's really easy to draw inappropriate conclusions. You were in love w/Claytons a few weeks ago, so what's changed?

FWIW, that vintage Krell I believe was when they were getting their highest accolcades, before Dan D. left the company. So one could argue that might be the best sounding Krells, along with the slightly older KSA-250.

The Pass Labs and hybrid Lamms still sound like what you are after IME. Another more budget friendly option is the Odyssey monoblocks.

In other threads you ponder speaker changes. Whatever you decide, please go with an amp and speakers that you've heard together or you have strong reason to believe will be symbiotic together. Cheers,
Spencer
aolmrd1241
1,042 posts
 
Fsmithjack,if you really want to hear what SS can do in 2015,as I have already mentioned,look into the Merrill Audio class d amps.

I owned an Edge NL10,which I really,really liked.Its gone and the Merrill Veritas is firmly ensconced in its place. The Veritas just plain crushed the Edge amp in every sonic parameter.Grip and control like a steel trap and at the same time nuanced like a butterfly in flight...Superb to the nines.
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