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Glare on Choral recordings, classical vocals

Dear all,

I'm hoping for some clarity on an issue of the quality of choral vocals in digital recordings. It's either my system or the recordings. There is a glare and harshness in the crescendos, and I wonder if it's natural room clipping in the studio or cathedrals in which they are recorded (the delay in some of these spaces can lead to a natural harshness and smearing of the sound), or if I have poor setup in terms of the DAC and/ or the preamp. I use a B&K PRO-10MC and a Schiit Bifrost Multibit. This setup has resolved any issues with digital glare except in the domain of choral music. Do I have to suck it up and consider upgrading to the Gungnir or another device? Should I consider a tubed preamp, maybe the Schiit Freya?

The problem is far less noticeable on vinyl, but most of my choral collection is in the digital domain. 

I've always had problems with the Tallis Scholars recordings on the Gimell label, which are almost always recorded in cathedrals. However, I did listen once to a Tallis Scholars CD on a dealer's rig with a Conrad-Johnson tube pre and Totem Model 1 Signatures, and there seemed to be much better resolution, though this was 20 years ago and I think my younger self was just blown away by the sound in general.

I've noticed that audiophiles and reviewers seldom write about choral music. Is it because they don't like choral music, or is it because it is just really difficult to record choirs well, therefore making choral music a poor choice to show off a system?

Any choral music-loving audiophiles care to comment on their experiences and solutions? 
 
Many thanks,


Paul
paulburnett
audioman58's avatar
audioman58
4,185 posts
 
The ps audio Direct stream incredibly good across the board 
And even better in 3 weeks after firmware upgrade.
randy-11
1,913 posts
 
Glare is unlikely to be due to room modes (which would affect bass) but could easily be due to moving a dipole speaker so the tweeter back wave fires into a glass window (don’t ask me how I know that).  It is certainly not due to speaker wire insulation.

What changed to before/after the glare? Or did nothing change except you bought some new recordings?  It sounds like it is limited to a single label, but occurs on several recordings(?)  If so, that suggests the way their engineers are making a "house sound."

No matter what, I’d spend a few $$ on diffusors long before spending a lot on new equipment, tubed or not.
rcprince
3,073 posts
 
Well, I sing in a couple of choruses and have done so all my life.  In certain acoustics, the treble voices in our choirs can sometimes be overpowering and create the glare you're talking about in real life, even though the voices are excellent. I would not underestimate the effect that the recording acoustic would have on the sound you're describing.  Do you have any recordings on the Telarc label of the Atlanta Symphony chorus under Robert Shaw?  Do you hear that glare with that chorus?  I generally don't get much glare from those recordings on my system, but I sometimes hear what you're describing on recordings of English choirs (the Cambridge Singers, for example) in very reverberant acoustics.
terry9
2,343 posts
 
I enjoy classical choral very much on my system. For whatever reason, the analogue material on Argo vinyl is beautiful, engaging, and non-fatiguing, while I never listen to digital vinyl for this material.

I can sometimes enjoy a Harmonia Mundi SACD by Anonymous 4, through a 10 KHz 6 db low pass filter.

Some might take this data as evidence against the 'defect in an individual system' hypothesis.
dweller's avatar
dweller
3,788 posts
 
More thoughts on causes of glare: Could be due to an imperfect crossover configuration. I remember reading a review of a speaker (can't remember which one) where the author stated the crossover points were at 200 hz and 2000 hz. He stated these were close to ideal as they did not affect the vocal range. An improperly designed crossover (crossover point within the vocal range) can have different drivers producing the same frequency causing IM distortion. Check your speaker's specs.

Another consideration is the composition itself. Composers like to "reinforce" the vocals with instruments of similar timbre (e.g. violins).
This could give the impression of glare when it might just be poor composition or the inability of the speaker to precisely delineate the two sources.
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