DACs and bass response?

lalitk wrote:

Speaking of your Synchro-Mesh reclocker, what about DAC’s internal jitter control? Is it not good enough to reduce jitter on a incoming digital signal? I am just trying to understand the need for external reclocker.  

My DAC is equipped with a high resolution, low jitter clock. The measurements show Intrinsic Jitter <10 pS.

I have yet to hear a DAC that is not sensitive to incoming jitter, even those with reclocking inside.  The easy way to tell is to use a cheap S/PDIF cable from a good low-jitter source and then a really good cable.  If you hear ANY difference, then it is sensitive to jitter.  I routinely ask my customers to do this test and 100% of the time they hear a difference.  Jitter almost always matters.

Intrinsic jitter is not a good indicator either.  This usually means that the internal clock jitter has this jitter specification.  This has little bearing on the actual jitter you hear from your DAC.  The associated circuitry and power delivery to that circuitry makes all the difference and usually increases that number 10-100 times.

I recently did jitter measurements on a device that advertised "intrinsic jitter" of less than a picosecond.  The measurements at the S/PDIF termination into 75 ohms showed jitter of 60-80 psec.  Lots of manufacturers say they eliminate all jitter.  Not possible.

Here is some really low jitter at the 75 ohm termination inside the DAC:

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=154310.0

Steve N.

Empirical Audio

Shadorne wrote:

Bass and power supply are linked in every way. This is because they share the same frequencies. The latest DACs are now using switched mode power supplies to great advantage at ultra high frequencies in order to get power supply noise far far away from the audible range.

Well, sort-of.  The real story is that the regulation on SMPS responds much faster than most LPS.  It has little to do with the 50 or 60Hz, more to do with the devices used, the "Q" of the storage capacitors and the technology used for regulation. 

LPS can also respond very fast, if the circuit is designed for it and the output device is really fast.  I provide such a fast LPS for my converter and reclocker products.  I also use SMPS in my Overdrive DAC.  They both can work for digital.

Steve N.

Empirical Audio

Thank you for your feedback and sharing the link. I guess that’s one way to promote external reclocker by taking a subpar DAC/Streamer. I do not know about anyone else but IMO, SONOS connect box is a piece of crap. It’s also one of the most antiquated streamer/DAC in their lineup.

The final jitter will be exactly the same, no matter what the source is. you can literally compete with a $20K transport using a $300 transport and a $1400 Synchro-Mesh and Dynamo power supply.  The input jitter to the Synchro-Mesh is totally unimportant. 

The Sonos is very popular and many folks like the interface well enough.  With the Synchro-Mesh reclocking, the Sonos actually sounds as good as any of my $3K digital interfaces, including USB and Ethernet.

Maybe you can post some measurements with Bluesound Node 2 or Aurender N100 and Synchro-Mesh reclocker.  Also, what degree of improvement justifies the cost of external reclocker and digital cables?

I would be happy to if I had one of these on hand.  So far, everything I have compared with the Synchro-Mesh has much higher jitter.

Having said that, I do recognize the importance of a quality digital source and DAC that employs best designs attributes to minimize or eliminate jitter within digital domain.

I would be open to try an external reclocker between my two sources Aurender N10 / Bluesound Vault 2 and ARC DAC9 in near future. At this time, I am very content and happy with fabulous sound output of my digital setup.

When you are ready, I have 30-day money-back on most of my products, less shipping. BTW, I also now offer a truly world-class S/PDIF BNC/RCA cable for $499. My whole career in audio has been devoted to achieving the lowest jitter.

Steve N.

Empirical Audio