2. digital
  3. 138846-18279

Where is my digital problem: taste, vinyl v. digital, DAC, realities, etc?

I want my digital to sound better.  While I have about 500 vinyl records, I really like being able to sample music first before buying what I know that I will listen to in the future.  I tend, though, to not want to listen as much to poorly recorded music or digital in general.  I'd like to get my digital sounding better to make it more engaging so I can listen longer and test out albums before purchasing.  

Here's what's going on with my digital end versus vinyl.  

Vinyl is holographic--spooky and romantic at times.  The sound fills the space better.  Digital emanates sound more directionally from the loudspeakers.
Vinyl makes certain instruments sound more realistic--i.e. horns, drum sticks, brushes, acoustic guitar/bass.
Vocals on vinyl (in particular when I play jazz vocals from 50s/60s) sound sublime. Digital is not bad, but the vocals sound less in the room and more like a picture of the recording session. 
Digital has more harshness, fatigue, and I cannot play things as loud or as long.  

My DAC is an NAD M51 (fed by Tidal to Bluesound Node 2 to DAC)
My phono pre is a Manley Chinook, taking its signal from a Technics 1200 GAE table and ART9 cartridge.
I seem to get this sound, as described above, regardless of speakers.  

On some level, I haven't spent as much money on the digital end as the analog end.  

Should I try another DAC?  Should I just conclude I'm a vinyl person and live with it?   I'd prefer not to go down the road of getting back into CDs because the beauty of Tidal high resolution is the ability to try out tons of stuff before purchasing the album.

If I try another DAC, what do folks recommend if my priorities are increasing holography, realism of individual instrument sounds, making vocals sound more in the room, and decreasing bite/harshness/glare, etc.   I'd really prefer not to spend Lampizator money.  Can I reasonably achieve an improvement in these objectives by going the route of Border Patrol, a tube DAC, or something in the $2k range?  

BTW, If I didn't love my vinyl sound so much I'd say the NAD M51 is a really great DAC.  



128x128jbhiller
jbhiller's avatar
jbhiller OP
1,437 posts
 
@ddude003, 

I love your way with words!  Yes, I'm pouring tube sweetness on tube syrup on tube everything.  Maybe I need to chill out a bit?  But man, I'm hooked on smoothness.  Right now I'm listening to Lou Rawls and Les McCann, Stormy Monday, on vinyl.  It's sooo tasty. 

@mahler123,  seriously?  You are one depressing soul.    I'm curious... have you heard a good analog system?  Ever?  One thing I can say for sure, I haven't heard digital keep the air on symbols, drums, and percussion.  It's hard, tight, clean but cut off.  Listen to Waltz for Debby on digitial.  There's no air or warmth on the brushes/symbol work.  That record should glow!   Mr. Mahler, I'd love to see you arm wrestle Michael Fremer! HA HA!  :)
lancelock
1,094 posts
 
@jbhiller,

On the bright side you have the same TT and cart that I have and it is a very very good analog combo. A well recorded piece of vinyl is just heaven. You could spend a great deal of money to get your digital end there but maybe not. I agree with @mapman and others as far as trying a NOS R2R DAC.

I have a relatively cheap $799 Oppo Sonica DAC/streamer and once it was returned from Modwright with a completely new tube output stage and separate power supply it comes close to my vinyl rig. Oppo is gone now but if I were looking for a DAC I would have to consider the Denafrips or the Lab12 DAC1 SE. 


mahler123
3,373 posts
 
Jbhiller
My last analog rig, which I gladly sold off after finally getting tired of vinyl propaganda and used the proceeds to help purchase a second DAC (Bryston BDA3), consisted of a Clearaudio Concept tt, Concept mc cart, and a Musical Surroundings phono preamp.  Total cost was about 4K.  I’ll leave it to you to decide if it was a “good analog system “. Before that I had a Rega P3 with a PSAudio Preamp, with whatever mm cart Rega included.  Before that, a Project starter system.
  My objections to vinyl were as stated in my first post.  My question for you is if you prefer analog sound, why are you trying to get a digital front sound that sounds analog?  Why not just spin your vinyl, have fun plucking the dust bunnies off the stylus, and enjoy the music?
wisnon
700 posts
 
Lampi Amber Dac 2 is in the $2K range. You can also get used Lampi L4 dacs for that kind of money too.
jbhiller's avatar
jbhiller OP
1,437 posts
 
@lancelock ,  Agreed!  It's a very good combination.  It's so hard to find anything wrong with the ART9.  I'd have to setup other carts (likely super expensive) and spend months comparing, which is not necessary as the ART9 is great.  

@Mahler,  In my OP I noted the reason I want my digital to sound better--I love being able to sample tons of different music first through Tidal before buying it on vinyl.  This saves money, time, and the exploration process is fun.  So the notion that I would just stay in the vinyl realm only is not ideal.   I really cannot pass judgment on your vinyl rigs of yore.  What I will say is that I've yet to hear a digital system do what vinyl does on jazz and vocals that I listen to.  If a rock recording has space and air in the recording then vinyl typically wins out too.  I don't know what you listen to or what you value so I'll leave it alone.  

@wisnon,  I appreciate that intel.  I'm really liking my system now so maybe make one more significant addition would be smart as I don't feel that I want to improve other stuff.

More to discover