Zu Soul Superfly

Paulfolbrecht:

It is certainly possible I will hear a class-d that does not sound like another class-d. I hope it sounds better.

I am merely stating fact that tri-path sounded as good (or bad) as $1000 Rotel.

I am not one of those people who thinks just because it costs more it is good.

PHIL: Non-audiophile people who don't notice and don't care are probably better served by $500 polks or $100 speakers available at any garage sale than $2000 Souls. Anyone who cares enough about sound to spend for the Souls really should care enough for at least modest placement.

I shake my head that you recommend tiny triode monoblock for Soul. Whomever follows up this advise is setting themselves up for disappointment. Unless of course they seek a congested midrange, and again, I point them to $500 polks (actually, $200 polk monitor so you can truly enjoy that choked sound). Well whatever. Maybe Curious_george is from the "plop them down" school of thought and does not care whether left is louder than right. That is his business of course.

Miklorsmith: 45W is OK. 5 or 8 is just not.

Having as much experience with Zu products and probably more than anybody posting here, it is unrealistic for any Zu speaker to perform optimally with a flea power SET/PSET amp be it 45, 50, PX-25, or 2A3.

Every Zu speaker, including models with a self contained subwoofer system, requires at least 15WPC; some need more.

No question they can be driven with single digit power but nowhere near their full capability.

IMO
YMMV
Dealer disclaimer

Amplifier question:

I was recently reading reviews on the Red Wine Audio 30.2 and it sounds as if it might be an absolutely perfect match for the Zu Soul Superflys. But at its price it was only a fantasy at the moment as I'm pretty effin' tapped out money wise.

Then yesterday I came across a post on Audiogon for a Tim Rawson-esqe clone of the amplifier (Wineclone). I don't speak technical, but it is affordable (albeit ugly) and I'm wondering if someone with both Zu experience and a more technical understanding of class d amps can tell me if they think this would be a good route.

If it were used I'd buy it and experiment for myself, but I don't want to take a depreciation hit if it doesn't work out.

I'd probably have it built with the available upgrades and minus volume control to use with my Minimax Preamp and two sources.

>>PHIL: Non-audiophile people who don't notice and don't care are probably better served by $500 polks or $100 speakers available at any garage sale than $2000 Souls. Anyone who cares enough about sound to spend for the Souls really should care enough for at least modest placement.<<

No, I don't agree. A non-audiophile music lover can easily appreciate the tone and dynamic superiority of a Zu speaker over what's possible from Polk-bracket speakers. They don't have to care about anything else to love Souls. "...at least modest placement..." conforms to my contention that such a person can put their Souls where they work for them in terms of room function and still appreciate the value of their purchase. They can learn about placement after they buy, and decide for themselves if any effort at optimization of the room for listening is worth the effort and possible inconvenience, to them.

>>I shake my head that you recommend tiny triode monoblock for Soul.<<

The Tiny Triode is 25/25w of EL84 power with ability to run in tetrode mode at closer to 40/40w. Come listen to what 20/20w of 845 SET muscle does on Soul. The 845 will outmuscle the EL84 but those amps will be just fine at the poster's budget and in most rooms.

>>Whomever follows up this advise is setting themselves up for disappointment.<<

He asked whether those amps will sound good on Soul. They will and they won't sound choked in the midrange in any unusual way. An 845 SET amp will sound better, but he's looking at a $700 option. At that price, given the options, the Tiny Triode will sound beautiful and even within its dynamic limits listening volume will be high enough. Like any push-pull tube amp, it will let you know through escalating congestion and compression (unlike most SS amps which will simply degrade precipitously) that you're running out of dynamic headroom as you raise volume. But the clean watts are going to give him a punchy, fulfilling sound. Soul sounds substantially more lively than Druid at moderate power, due to the shove of the newer driver motor.

>>That is his business of course.<<

Ain't that the truth.

>>Miklorsmith: 45W is OK. 5 or 8 is just not.<<

Read more closely. He didn't say 45w. He wrote "45 SET," meaning his single-ended-triode amps using the 45 triode tube. He's referring to 2 watts or so on his Definitions.

***

Again, the point of contention here is that you want all the advice here to be "audiophile" targeted. I'm happy to give the audiophile view but my larger objective is to remove perceived barriers to interest in high-end audio. People who aren't yet in the tent but are investigating our realm use Google, Yahoo and Bing to explore and they find what we write here, in AudioAsylum, AudioCircle and similar. We aren't just talking to ourselves here.

Zu expressly designed Soul to be unfussy, for anyone who loves music in their life to buy and appreciate without complication. It's designed to sound shockingly good on a $300 receiver taking signal from a PC/DAC or a $49 CD player, as well as be worthy of the full gamut of obsessive audiophilia and the best possible gear that can be associated with it.

Zu succeeded, even beyond their prior such success with Druid 4-08.

In the grand scheme of available amplification for a person on a budget, used Tiny Triodes or anything else similar to them are going to sound impressive and convincing on a pair of Superfly. They really do simplify. Let's open doors, not shut them. Now if someone has a question about $7000 amps rather than $700, my answer might reflect a more demanding POV.

Phil

I can't say how well Rawson clones or emulates the sonic character of Red Wine. I've heard Red Wine and other various Class D architectures on Zu speakers. In Red Wine's case, the sound is very smooth and listenable, certainly preferable to many far more expensive and ghastly solid state amplifiers. Their sins are of omission. While less so than many of thier ilk, the Red Wine amps still sound desiccated, spatially flattened and a little bleached of midrange tone compared to alternatives in their price range. It's not a sound I can live with if I don't have to, and I don't. On the positive side, Rossi's amps are quiet, dynamic, smooth on top and bass is fast and well-defined.

If Rawson builds a good clone, depending on his price and how you view the competitive options financially, you might value the positives over the negatives. Zu thinks Red Wine Audio amps are good matches to their speakers. Others here do, too.

Even at under $1000, I'd rather have a number of affordable Asian tube amps or some used tube and solid state options from Audiogon if I were financially tapped and needed amplification.

Phil