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Subwoofer Question

With the help of many in this community I have put together a two channel system I am very happy with. I am a proponent of both vinyl and streaming so the setup is as follows:

Plinius Hiato Integrated Amp
Dynaudio Contour S 3.4LE speakers
Martin Logan Balance Force 210 sub
Dr. Feickert Volare turntable with Jelco tonearm and Lyra Delos MC cartridge
Innuos Zenith server
Lumin T2 streamer/dac
Bryston CD player (don’t use much)
Analysis plus copper speaker cable and interconnects 

The ML sub was something I bought to augment a pair of Magnepan 1.6 speakers before I revamped everything. Quite frankly I didn’t know what I was doing; the thing is huge, difficult to position and I’m not sure I’m getting the bang for my buck.  It gives a boom for sure but is a bit muddy and I don’t have a lot of good positioning options. It just feels like it is too much and not a fit with everything else. My listening room is fairly small and I sit about 10-12 feet away from the speakers.  Because this hobby induces a never ending need to upgrade/tweak I have been thinking about replacing the ML with two smaller subs such as the REL T/7i’s or T/9i.  I do like bass so I feel I need/want a sub. In my research I also keep reading that subs make the midrange sound better if you have the right setup.
Am I crazy? Would very much appreciate thoughts and opinions.

thanks
Ag insider logo xs@2xpuppyt
erik_squires
16,457 posts
 
Hey OP:
As you may have seen, to me the issue of integration of a sub is critical.


The sub must integrate to the speakers at the top of it's range, and the room everywhere else.


So, I strongly suggest before you start to talk to GIK Acoustics regarding room treatment, especially bass traps. This may solve your problem with your current sub, and make your current set up sound a lot better.


After this, consider a subwoofer only EQ. If you don't like that idea, then get your two REL subs, but I would strongly encourage you to make your room more speaker/sub friendly with room treatment if not already.

Best,
E
millercarbon's avatar
millercarbon
12,531 posts
 
I have been thinking about replacing the ML with two smaller subs such as the REL T/7i’s or T/9i. I do like bass so I feel I need/want a sub. In my research I also keep reading that subs make the midrange sound better if you have the right setup.

Don’t replace, but do add the two. Even better, add three. The problem you’re having isn’t so much the sub being ML as that its just one sub. With only one you’re forced to move the damn thing around trying to find the one spot where the magic happens and the bass is extended and smooth. But the magic never happens. Never can. Because, physics. No matter where you put one sub it will always result in lumpy uneven tubby bass that never goes as deep as you want but thumps more than you want.

The answer is lots of subs. The more subs you use the lower each one can be, you be able to turn the ML down a lot, and this helps reduce boominess. Also with more subs you can set it to roll off lower, maybe even completely eliminating any output in the boominess range. Another thing that helps is they go different locations so create different modes in different places and at different frequencies. Finally you are not relying on one alone to extend really deep. These things all add together to result in much smoother, deeper and more articulate bass than you could ever get with just one sub, EQ/GIK regardless.
cbrents73's avatar
cbrents73
151 posts
 
Have you, or are you able to, run the Anthem Room Correction software on your ML Sub (labeled PBK)?  If not, you haven’t maximized the potential of what that woofer can do.  Running the Room Correction will make a shocking improvement by helping it integrate better to your room and blend more seamless with your speakers.
Ag insider logo xs@2x
puppyt OP
100 posts
 
I haven’t done the room correction. I seem to remember you needed a PC and it wasn’t compatible with a Mac but I will check into that.

thanks
Ag insider logo xs@2x
puppyt OP
100 posts
 
I just checked and the software is available for Mac. I will get the kit and do this.

thanks for the suggestion @cbrents73
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