Seriously considering tube preamp…opinions?

@decooney ey
Re: Key Question (speakers): "Are you 100% settled on Salk Wow1s"
Answer: They are ordered. Not auditioned yet and returnable. I'll have to eat the shipping. A lot of research went into picking them, so I'm really inclined to give them a charitable listen.

Regarding the QS Mono 60s (vs Mid Monos) — Yes. I would do that. I just agreed with Tvad that he's right about not skimping now and paying later. So I'm reaching into the college fund (kidding) and altering my budget. As you point out, this is not just doing something that is good for the speakers, but it is opening the door to change.

As for thinking amortized over initial cost — I'm there with you. I can accept this as an argument. My price limit just got more flexible but it's based on good reasons provided here and not on sales pitches or vanity/luxury bs from a dealer. That's a critical factor for me.

@tvad Re: "Auditioning amplification prior to settling on speakers is an audio merry go around."
Answer: Yes, you're right, and I see that it's reaching a terminus. But I'm not that up in the air about speakers — I know I like the Dyns and I suspect I'll like the Salks. But I do need to give it a rest and let the (speaker chips) fall where they may. That said, once I do pick a speaker — high or low sensitivity — the research folks have helped me compile and the listening I've done is still valueable. But you're right if you're saying that I'm at the point of diminishing returns! Time for me to just "cool it."

I had a Schiit Freya pre last year. Sold it as the tube circuit was a bit too noisy for me. Tried different tubes. It's real nice tho. My 100db speakers may have been why. I have a PL amp (not pre) and it's built like tank. Can't go wrong w/PL. 

I've bought from Upscale, great service all around. Buy there w/confidence. 

To: @hilde45

You CAN get great sound of your 84db Salk Wow1s If you bought them already. :) Those or most Dynaudio speakers will require some grunt. Looking at 20w integrated amps gives ideas on tube/tone, but not what is needed to get the most out of your Wow1s.

Matching is everything.

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No need to "chill", research is what got you here. However, just be aware underbuying now MIGHT cost you more IF you choose to upgrade again later (speakers or preamps or amps). Good 2nd hand gear is an option too, but you lose "warranty" in most cases. Gotta know what to buy, and buying 1-2 year old gear that someone overlooked is one angle.

Other Options to buy "up":
I see people buy (and immediately resale) decent solid state and tube gear and resale in 60 days or less because they 1) don’t burn in tubes, don’t burn in coupling caps, -or- allow the really good SS amp burn in over 300hrs; or simply listen to gear cold (premature judgements) in less than 45 minutes warmup, 2) often use cheap so called "budget" interconnect cables between components that veil over or filter the sound vs. let it through... 3) use oddball preamp and amp combos with mismatched in/out voltage 4) poorly matched speakers for a particular amplifier application, 5) get off track with misinformation.

Something to be said for a good preamplier and amplifier that is designed to work together, right from the designer. This is partly why some folks just go with integrated amplifiers if they are not sure what to do. That’s why I felt the Pass INT-60 might also be an option for you, IF you do not go all-tube preamp and amp.

@tvad  I asked Jim that question in early January, when I was buying the speakers. He gave this answer, which I have used to set some basic, minimum standards: "I would look for a minimum of about 100 watts for solid state and 30 watts for a tube amp (the more the better in both cases). The reason is that the way these amps clip is different. The solid state amp will be linear until it reaches its maximum output and then clip, becoming overly bright and edgy. As you increase the gain (volume) with a tube amp, it is linear to a point near its maximum output. As you increase it further, it acts somewhat like a compressor and simply limits the maximum output. So it is “soft” clipping as opposed to “hard” clipping. For that reason, you can get by with less wattage with tube amps. People who love tube amps love the liquid-smooth midrange they provide. But they don’t have quite as tight a grip on the bass. If you want tighter bass, then solid state becomes more attractive. The bottom line, then, becomes “what is more important to you...liquid smooth performance or tight bass performance.” Other than that, as long as the basic amp design is good, wattage becomes the most important (since amps are very accurate compared to speakers)."

Regarding the audition of the speakers, I have Adcom separates at the moment. Jim thought they'd be adequate to try out the speakers. There's a problem of too many variables, here — I cannot choose an amp until I have settle the variable of the speakers, but I cannot choose which speakers while also changing amps. So, I'm going to keep the amp constant — my present one, which I know pretty well — and then pay attention to how Salk speakers sound as compared with Dyns, etc.

Thanks, Scott. Appreciate hearing your experience.

@decooney Yes, I think that's right and it aligns with what Jim Salk said about his speakers. 30w min. on tubes. Noting all you said about buying "up." And I've written to Reno HiFi to know their views and stock in case going solid state was important.

But the INT60 is 60 watts, right? And Jim Salk said 100 watts minimum, right? I suspect the answer for this Pass Labs stuff is going to be in the "not all watts are the same" category — right? So a 60w Pass Labs solid state should be plenty for these Salks. Have I suspected corrected that this is the answer to that question?

While going integrated or matching from the same brand seems the safe route, and one I will probably take, there are numerous experienced folks here who have made a good argument that it can be done. That's why I feel it might be a good way to go.