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I admire Miles Davis, i admire Stravinsky; but i loved Chet Baker and Scriabin...You?

What we listen to we cannot trace always a border between cold or cool admiration and heart wrenching love at first sight....

I admire Bach without limit but i love also him dearly....Here admiration and love are one....

The first time li listen to Chet Baker i was not even sure if it was a great trumpetist, but i love him without knowing why....

More i listen to Miles Davis more i admire him but i still wait for love to come....I like it a lot but it is not love and i know the first time i listen to him why he is a great trumpetist, unlike Chet, his mastering of the instrument was evident.... For Chet i listen not the trumpet but the voice of his instrument, i even forgot he was playing the trumpet and the question if he was great was secondary....Miles was great without any doubts.... But i am in love with Chet because he touch my heart.....



Sometimes the frontier between these 2 are less clear, i admire Brahms but i like him more than i love him.... Bruckner i admire him like a new Bach and i love him like our old grandpa with a feeling that will never end....

I admire Monteverdi at the level of my admiration for Bach, but i like him only , it is not this passionnate love that changes my heart and life like with those i love...

I love Bill Evans dearly but i admire Keith Jarrett greatly but without any passion....

I admire and love Vivaldi at the same times.....

I admire Telemann, Haendel, Haydn more than i love them..... I am in love with Purcell tough and Josquin Desprez.....

I admire Hildegard the Bingen and i love her without words.... I am in love with the organ composer Pachelbel but i only admire Palestrina....

I admire Arvo Part very much, but am i in love? No....Excep perhaps for one or 2 of his work: Alina for example....I admire and love Gorecki symphony of tears but not much the rest....Only respect for the rest of his works....

I admire Arrau, Horowitz, many pianists but am i in love? No, but i am in total love with Ervin Nyiregyházi , Ivan Moravec, or Sofronitsky....

I admire the composer Sorabji almost like Bach but dont feel any love at all....Deep fascination and admiration for a genius  that never speak from the heart to the heart, only from his brain to my brain.... But what a genius ! 

I admire many, many, female singers, but i am in love with only a few, i love Billie Holiday, Marianne Anderson for example....

I will not go on with my list any longer...

But what speak to our heart and what speak to our brain is not the same and sometimes some music speak for us to the 2 part of ourselves...

But one thing must me clear, i dont want to live without the great musicians whom i only admire. I like them like interesting friends, even if i am not changed by love at first sight with them, swimming in the sea of adoration....


What are those you admire but only like ? What are those you clearly are in love with?

When the brain speak first and always, it is admiration and friendship not love.... In love there is a mystery in with we participate and which transform our life....

Those who we admire gives us pleasure.... Those who we love gives us not only that but an ultimate meaning that go to your heart.....


Listening music is learning to listen into the many levels in us where music can reach and transform us.... Each music or musician has this potential to change us at a level or at another one, or at all levels simultaneously....But for sure it is different for each of us......

I apologize if my OP makes no sense for some.... I hope my question will make sense for some....

Thanks......

128x128mahgister
stuartk
2,907 posts
 
Yes; "taste" is indeed a mystery.   I suspect, had we access to the entire spectrum of what we call a human being, we might have a better sense of what constitutes "taste". Music operates on multiple levels, some that are fairly evident and others that remain hidden from view for most of us.

I have a visceral dislike of the classically trained voice. Why? I could say that it sounds artificial or inauthentic to me, but does such terminology   really get to the heart of my antipathy? No. I suspect there is something else going on. Perhaps it's a result of experiences from past lives. Or, perhaps it has more to do with something that cannot be explained intellectually-- sound as vibration-- affecting me on levels I cannot perceive, only feel, and in a rather primitive manner at that-- solely in terms of liking or disliking. Call it resonance. 

Perhaps, the music we most love tunes us or entrains us within, a vibration or range of vibrations that connect us to a level of being we most crave to experience, whether we're cognizant of it or not. We could come up with all sorts of reasons why we love or hate Engelberg Humperdink, EmmyLou Harris, Yanni, Al Green, Ali Akbar Khan, Sara Vaughan or Kiri Takanawa  without ever perceiving what's going on at what might be called a subtle or soul level.

I'm theorizing that we recognize when what we're hearing resonates with this level because of how it makes us feel and how much we like whatever that feeling may be. For some, it may be peace; for others, aggression, excitement, melancholy or anger. People are "tuned" differently and so, enjoy "resonating" with different qualities of vibration. 

I have no idea if this is how things are or not; it's simply an attempt to expore possibilities within the bounds of my life experience and conceptual framework.  









mahgister's avatar
mahgister OP
13,133 posts
 
I read you post with great interest.... You are spot on...

I think the same as you...

I think we must take the time to learn and educate our "taste" toward something larger...

But we cannot change totally what we are.....The precise connection we have with music, the privileged channel we used will not change... But the road we travel may be enlarged and can be made to encompass more than what is in our past history...

My best to you and my thanks for this interesting reflexion of yours....


niodari's avatar
niodari
301 posts
 
There is a very nice album of Kenneth Wheeler with John Taylor -  i also like Wheeler. Check out also Paolo Fresu if you like trumpet.
stuartk
2,907 posts
 
mahgister:  I felt, with that last post, I was going out on a limb somewhat to speak in such esoteric terms on an Audiogon forum and am glad it resonated with you. 

If you have the time and inclination, I'd be very interested to hear your thoughts re: the process of "education".

As it happens, I seem to have arrived at a point where it's become extremely difficult to find music I like enough to buy. I'm wondering whether I've exhausted the possibilities that exist within the limits of my taste and how one might expand the boundaries. 







frogman
7,464 posts
 
Excellent comments, both. Last night I began to write a post which I did not finish nor post (for no good reason) which read something like this:

**** I both admire and love your attitude, mahgister.. Conviction and/in evenhandedness.

Stuartk, the idea that Miles was not a particularly accomplished player, technically, is a myth. This notion sadly points to the lack of musical acumen on the part of some so called “critics”. There is a very important difference between a musician such as Miles sometimes sounding technically rough or unpolished because of actual technical limitations as an instrumentalist and playing in a way that could be interpreted as such for emotional effect. This is a deliberate stylistic choice....controlled technical abandon, if you will. The proof of this can be found in the many recorded examples of his beautifully controlled and virtuosic playing. ****

Segueing to more recent comments, I must include Stuartk in my admiration for the attitudes expressed. Attitudes and comments that support something that I have often felt is sorely lacking in discussions about music and musicians.

IMO, in order to make a more complete and honest assessment of the true value of a musician’s musical vision the listener needs to have, at least, a modicum of humility. I think that “humility” encapsulates much of what I think your recent comments express. Before passing ultimate judgment it would be most productive to acknowledge that our feelings and reaction to an artist’s musical vision is inevitably colored by our own individual experiences; not only as as listeners, but life in general. It is well and good, as is often suggested, to “listen to what you like” and leave it at that without any effort whatsoever to get past, or even acknowledge our built-in biases. Obviously, this is a personal call as some feel that art should not require any effort whatsoever on the part of the “consumer” (listener); that there should be immediate gratification. I disagree. This attitude is very limiting and shuts the door to growth as a listener. Not only will this limit the exploration of artists that are not immediately enjoyed, but it limits the depth of appreciation of those that we do enjoy. It also makes it far easier to recognize the imposters.
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