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Equal $$ for Phono OR Streaming?

Consider the following situation. A friend who's watched me put together my system has decided to follow suit. He's inherited some very good speakers and amplification (no DAC) from a relative and has about wants to finish out the main elements of the system with the best possible source. He has about $4-6k to spend and wishes to spend it on either a phono stage/TT combo OR a DAC/streamer combo. (For content, he is willing to spend either on vinyl or streaming services to fulfill whichever path he chooses above.)

Focusing simply on the potential for sonic quality (rather than, say, the variety of music one can stream), where do you think his money would best be spent and why? Could he reach the same outcomes after spending on a TT, cartridge, phono stage, record cleaner, isolation table and all the other accoutrements necessary for a good phono set up as he could if he bought a good DAC, streamer, etc.?

If your tastes weigh so heavily toward analog or digital that you can simply decide this without considering the details of the comparison, please try to set those aside and answer based on what he might be able to get for $4-6k.

128x128hilde45
millercarbon's avatar
millercarbon
12,531 posts
 
In the OP your friend had $4k to $6k to spend. Now it changes to "excluding cost" which is fine. Either way, even at the original $4 to 6k if what he wants is sound quality this is easy. 

Buy the Decware ZP3, fabulous phono stage for $1300. Buy something like a Benz Glider with .7mV output so you don't need the SUT. This brings him to about $2k.

At this point he has a cart and phono stage that will make just about any turntable sound great. All he needs is a table with arm and built-in phono lead. To avoid having to spend money on a phono interconnect. He can spend the rest of his budget, $2k, $4k or whatever, on a great turntable. All kinds of options there. 

And there you go. Done. Not hard at all.   

Only problem, it will not be "roughly equivalent." It will be "vastly superior." I hope your friend will be okay with that?
hilde45's avatar
hilde45 OP
4,974 posts
 
@millercarbon No change of meaning. I said he "wants to finish out the main elements of the system" and has "$4-6k to spend...on either a phono stage/TT combo OR a DAC/streamer combo." The qualifier "excluding" was meant to convey that the core of the decision for him excludes the other elements -- records, streaming services, etc. I'm glad you grasped that because your suggestion is specific and useful. And "vastly superior" sounds, um, vastly superior.
millercarbon's avatar
millercarbon
12,531 posts
 
Oh well then my suggestion will totally do it.  

When it comes to "equivalent" the problem there is the meaning of "equivalent". A road well-traveled. If equivalent means sounds the same, then you would try and find a cartridge/phono stage combination with edge, grain, glare, hyped top end sterile midrange and anemic bass that sounds the same as streaming. This believe it or not can be done! Start with a Rega, add AudioTechnica, throw in a solid state phono stage. 

You see where this is going? It is not so much "equivalent" as "what you like". The stuff I recommended, it will draw you in, enthrall, mesmerize. But it will in no way, shape or form be "equivalent" to digital. Not if equivalent means sounds the same. 

Sorry to have to explain but the quality of analog is so off the charts compared to streaming that to even ask about "equivalent" calls for a whole lot of clarification. Its like asking, what would be the equivalent car to a motorcycle? What do you mean? 0-60? Top speed? Bugs on the face vs the windshield? See what I mean?
lalitk's avatar
lalitk
5,450 posts
 
“If equivalent means sounds the same, then you would try and find a cartridge/phono stage combination with edge, grain, glare, hyped top end sterile midrange and anemic bass that sounds the same as streaming. ”

@millercarbon,
I needed a good laugh, thanks for your post 😂
artemus_5's avatar
artemus_5
1,930 posts
 
@hilde45

35:30, "You're going to have to spend more $$$ to get great analog". But @ 34:25 he says that in the tests done most all liked analog better. This has been my experience also. The analog chain consists of the turntable, arm, cartridge & phono preamp. Each one is important. IMO, the phono preamp is as important as the TT & arm. I've heard others say that a good arm will make a less expensive cartridge sound better. I can understand that. But that is still 3 major influences you have to purchase along with the IC's to connect them. It will eat up $6k pretty quickly IMO.

Then there is the vinyl ritual. It used to be said that if you don't like this ritual,  you should not get into vinyl. Cleaning machine & fluids, plus sleeves have not been addressed. Again, I prefer the vinyl sound but it is not as convenient nor as inexpensive. As he said in the podcast, buy both if you can. That's what I did and I would not change that.
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