Synergistic calls out Audioholics


Curious to see what Gene does...

https://youtu.be/PKLuLfj2iC4


perkri
At the 2018 AXPONA Ted had a room set up with his stuff using Magico speakers. He demoed a song with his HFT thingies and his small bass boxes and then removed them. I couldn't hear a difference regarding the HFTs but I did think I could hear a small difference with the little bass cubes. Then he shut off the Atmosphere thing in the middle and WHOA! The soundstage collapsed and the entire presentation went flat and dry. I looked around the room and everyone I could see looked shocked. It was not a subtle difference. I am a skeptic about tweaks but this was unmistakable. I could easily hear a difference.

I don't know what the Atmosphere does but it does something. I can't make heads or tails regarding the explanation on his website but I really want to hear that thing again.

All his stuff is like that. Some more dramatic than others. But all works beautifully. 

However, just as we aren't able to prove with measurement everything we are able to hear, so also we are not all experienced or skilled at recognizing every aspect of the music that we hear. 

Not playing word games, but words are involved. There is a very real debate as to whether we hear first, or have the words first, or if these two seemingly unrelated things somehow happen together. 

But when you think about it- music. What is the difference between music and any other sound? We joke about it with music we don't like, rap or whatever, and say, "That's not music." But seriously, where does this idea come from, that certain patterns of pressure waves are music while others are not? 

It is very common for people to take things for granted, then use these assumptions to leap to others. The scientists did this years ago with MP3. They tested and measured and found "masking" and other supposed phenomena meant we can compress files down to a fraction, throwing away huge chunks of data, because measurement PROVES people cannot hear it. 

We laugh at this today, because today we all can hear it. Probably pretty much everyone could hear it even back then. Although I remember well the mockery I got for saying this, so maybe not. 

Anyway, point is that even though we do indeed "hear" everything, in the sense of the sound volume is loud enough to register, there are large chunks of what we "hear" that we do not have words for, therefore we do not recognize them, and so in a very fundamental way we do not hear  them at all- in the sense that we recognize the patterns for what they are. 

This higher level hearing is what we call listening. There is a vast difference between having good hearing and being a good listener. Hearing we can test with tones and meters. Listening we test with things like HFT and Atmosphere.  

When you get to the point where you are able to hear all these things, then you will know. These abilities do not just happen. Sometimes might take quite a while and a good deal of effort to get there. When you do though then everything I just said will be crystal clear. Until then, go and listen. You will see.   



@prof 
Unless you have proof of fraud, you are left with overstated marketing hype.  How are you going to prove anything when there are so many happy customers and impressed professional reviewers?  Why even argue about it?  Let them hear what they hear, believe what they believe, and be happy with their cables and tweaks.  If you don't believe the SR claims, don't buy the products.  Why have a dog in the fight?
Hi Mitch,

As if it isn’t clear enough: I’m not accusing anyone or any company of "fraud."



You brought up the subject of "IF <--- note the "If" - a company sold a product that doesn’t do what it claims, but some people believe it and pay for it, what’s the harm?"


I was curious how the logic of your take on that has implications in other consumer areas. But I guess you don’t want to play that out to see the implications.



As I have said a billion times here: I’m fully supportive of anyone buying whatever they want for whatever reason! If someone doesn’t give a damn about objective verification, tries a product, "hears" something that makes him happy and he wants to pay for it...GREAT for that person! Nobody should be forced in to any particular method of buying gear. Follow your bliss. So you seem to have made some incorrect inference about my attitude.


All I’m saying is: what’s wrong with anyone testing a product using objective data, relevant to the claims made for the product? As I said, isn’t the more information we have for a product the better, given the wide range of approaches many audiophiles bring to the hobby? If you don’t care about certain objective data, don’t bother with it. If you do, then it’s nice to have it available.


As for SR’s products: Anyone who likes the products and buys them on their own subjective impressions, enjoy!


Personally I’d prefer to see some of the claims objectively verified by another technically competent party, before I would be ready to buy such things. Which is why I’d like to see Gene take up SR’s offer. That would be fun and possibly very interesting. And like I said, I would actually like it if SR’s products had some objective verification. That would be cool, and it would increase my own interest in the products...who knows maybe even purchasing one of them.


But, again, that’s my personal criteria for certain products, and I begrudge no one who takes a different approach.


(I’m not going to insult people as "clowns" etc as I have received from others on this thread. I respect anyone’s right to practice the hobby in the way they enjoy).

Cheers!

(I think I’m outta this thread. If Gene measures the stuff I’m sure there will be another thread on the outcome).