The Absurdity of it All
Perkri, The best you can do is to get the bass right at the listening position by doing all those things you mention. As many here have noticed other than rebuilding your media room the best way to deal with the bass problem is by adding multiple subwoofers. Room treatments come into play at higher frequencies above 250 Hz. It is undeniable true that many fine systems are ruined by room acoustics. |
If you don't know what the word substantiated means, I don't think we can progress any further in this discussion. Good day. |
I listened some costly tweak product on youtube marketed by a well known company and it is EVIDENT that there is an audible effect.... Was that the one where he placed a large metal object (effectively) right against the microphone? Well duh! (not to you), of course that is going to make a difference! Or is it the one that had the shelved output that would not correlated to the communicated changes? All this is readily evident when you do correlated analysis of the audio samples. Not everything is as it seems. |
@jpeters568Excellent post! My own remark FIRST To perceive something especially a change which can be subtle, and characterize this change positively or negatively ask for some pre-requisite... We must use some cd or vinyl whe know very much by heart already We must choose a recording with these characteristic: natural acoustic of the instrument sound, and human voices first with piano or orchestra or few acoustic instrument... No pop, no rock, Why? Because changes being detected they will ask to be judged by reference points... No commercial music sound natural, all is modified, and it is the TIMBRE natural experience which will be our signpost ALL ALONG the journey.... Distortions and sibilance are always detected easily if we use a known reference point: acoustic natural timbre in non amplified, or non electrical instruments and especially voices... SECOND Nothing can be clearly perceived and understood without a CONCEPT to seize it consciously and describe it... Then we must read about acoustic ...And If there is 3 working embeddings dimensions to modify and make cleaner with controls settings and devices : mechanical , electrical, and acoustical... The most important one is acoustical... Acoustic of a room is so powerful even experience audiophiles here underestimated it.... The room is not easy to control and as it has been said many times, it’s the biggest part of the system.He is right absolutely.... For acoustic controls there is no easy road.... It takes time... this is the bad news... The good news is it is possible to ststematically afress it in a dedicated room without investing money only by hearing experiments with only homemade devices but it will not be esthetical... The living room will ask for more money and even more difficulties because of the limitations you can impose in a living room... The most useful piece in a system is not any piece of gear it is a dedicated room.... If someone is not being limited by money and he is so proud of his gear that his pleasure is boasting about it, his experience cannot help us...My system value is 500 dollars and i have hear better system than mine, it is easy to look for them on youtube....But if they are better in the absolute concretely it is an another story which can be telled only by acoustic means... In ratio S.Q. /price my system is one if not the best i ever listen to.... The goal is reaching audiophile experience for ordinary mortal with very limited money... Then a dedicated room is the greatest gift.... By the way acoustic treatment with passive materials is mandatory but in a small room had his limits.... We must also controls timing of the wavefronts and ACTIVE means of controls could help tremendously: Resonators, ionizers, Schumann generators, BUT especially powerful : a mechanical equalizer based on Helmholtz acoustic resonators principles....An Helmholtz resonator can adress all acoustic problems in his own way: imaging, timbre, soundstage, listener envelopment factor in relation to sound width of the source... Why? Because a room is a very tigth pressure zone, like a set of strings on a violin....Each pipes and tubes resonastors introduce a different pressure which will damp AND enhance different frequencies...The set of tubes will be like a silent orchestra on his own, and the location of tubes and each pipes would be important and even the orientation of the variable neck position in the room linked to each pipes and tubes... With a mechanical equalizer you modify the room for your speakers with your ears to control the fine tuning process... An electronic equalizer is different and use a mic and is valid measure are for a millimeter precise location not for a human body location in the room...It can be a useful tool but cannot replace acoustic control by only itself.... A mechanical equalizer is PART of the room... It is an active tool modifiable through time... It is not esthetical for sure.... But some are more crafty than me... This is my mechanical equalizer that teach me this: one could destruct acoustically a room/system or revive it completely with an audible effect very powerful with only a straw of very thin diameter, and short lenght at the right location or not....Then changing an amplifier will never be able to compete with this straw save going from a shitty amplifier to a better one... Nothing less will compare.... Acoustic is the key to audio experience if you had already choosen relatively BASIC good gear...But chosing good gear is the easy part of the journey... The rest is marketing ignorance voluntary or unvolontary.... This is my experience.... |
No i listen to ALL the video on youtube with many customers...I listened some costly tweak product on youtube marketed by a well known company and it is EVIDENT that there is an audible effect.... Simple... But an audible effect is one thing, and not the story... Remember: i personaly NEVER BUY "tweaks" I created my own at NO COST.... Negating an audible effect is not my way...I will let sunday club scientist debunking some unreal and sometimes some real audible effects.... Investigating to create a better effect at no cost is my way....i prefer my listening experiments... It is better to teach people how to fish without complicated means or tools than to use blindtest to criticize any means or tool for fishing without teaching people how to fish at NO COST....Some effects created by costly tweaks are real.... Negating all audible effects is non productive.... I prefer to assume the effect is there and VERIFYING IT at no cost....Improving my audio system is my goal, not a pretense to science with blindtest.... I am not against blindtest... Why not? Especially for costly product... But this does not solve the problem of HOW to improve at no cost my audio system... I prefer sometimes assuming that something is real, some acoustical audible effect and trying to replicate it at NO COST... why contesting in principle ALL testimonies like placebos? The goal of a statiscal experiment using blindtest cannot be useful for me, save for particular spectacular costly product... It is not a general solution for customers listening their music and wanting to improve their S.Q..... Making my own listening experiment at no cost or at low cost is more useful and fun...Speaking about the results in my case is not promoting a brand i use only homemade or very low cost products... Simple.... Nobody learn to fish blindfolded... |
