What is the “World’s Best Cartridge”?

Dear @mikelavigne : With all respect and re-reading your posts in this thread shows me that your mental attitude changed a little in the last months or years ( no issue with because averything is changing always. ) and I don’t know if is because the " pressure " over your system and way of thinking in the thread or because you really changed. Let me explain about:

first I can read that you bougth the Dava by the " be spoke " in the forum and that I remember that was not " normal " in you on personal audio issues. The Dava stampede strated around 2020 by " be spoke " gentlemans mainly in your forum and exactly as today ( 2 years latter. ) with no web site by the manufacturer and not only neither cartridge measurements but not even ( till today ) specs . Yes, all of you Dava owners can say: who cares, we like what we listen with.

Obviously you are a part of that stampede and obviously a follower and I never knew this " follower " new attitude in you.

 

Next two statements by your part that speaks of other change:

 

" why do i even come to Audiogon? sillyness. "

" i simply do not see the value to me in this thread. "

 

It looks as something way " presumptuous " and I can’t remmeber you that way. Fine with me, no problem.

 

" ultimate performance does not involve digital.....in any step. "

 

that’s your today subjective " absolutism ".

 

I read the 2020 thread  and after around 500 posts ( including yours. ) no one of those gentlemans writed any single word about cantilever-less heavy tracking and developed distortions issues, no one and no one mentioned any single word about cartridge specs .

You already had and still have noise " problems " with that cartridge, with out mention what a gentleman posted here about those 2 extra wires for the cartridge power supply that goes against the " free " movements on your tonearm, not a good notice and you accepted ( ? ? ? ).

I think that in the last 2-3 years you made a come back to the audio past when you bougth a phono stage tube design and along that you find out that the external SUTs performs better than the one inside the phono stage ( you posted those in Agon threads ). Tubes is an electronic alternative and the worst place to use it is to handled cartridges and specially LOMC ones. In the other side, SUTs are named as " passive " devices and almost every one ( mainly tube lovers. ) says makes less degradation to the cartridge signal vs a couple of active bipolar devices ( really small and " ridiculous " devices. ) but things are that SUTs are far aways to be passive but are really " active " with the cartridge signal because this signal travels a huge number of m. through the transformers, cables and connectors and that signal it’s almost coupled relationship degrading at each mm. the cartridge signal way higher that those couple bipolar devices and not only that because the SUT has limited frequency response at both frequency extremes where your Dartzeel has not. Btw, you have good relationship with Dartzeel designer and can ask him why in the design the designers always are looking for the shortest path for where the audio signal must pass through.

 

Next link speaks of the cartridge importance tracking issue and I know that some audiophiles already read it somewhere and know the issue very well. We don’t need to be a technical oriented audiophile because it’s asy to understand the tracking information overall issue explained there. As me you only need to read carefully/slow. I’m posting the link because @mijostyn and I posted that cartridge tracking abilities is the main cartridge design characterisitc ( I have no less than 15 years posting the same. ) that even with out the link is just " common sense ":

 

http://pspatialaudio.com/analogy.htm

 

""  A rigid cantilever will offer no relief from this inevitable resonance on the tracking ability of the stylus. And tracking is king: an unyielding cantilever could introduce high frequency mistracking with its insiduous ability to damage records without betraying the damage it is doing. "

 

Everything here is posted in good shape, no other kind of attitude/agenda.

 

R.

 

 

I have no trouble understanding @rauliruegas  and in general I tend to agree with him but other than, " I do not believe that the members of this thread realize what they are talking about," I have no idea what @nandric is trying to say. Is this just me or are others having the sane problem? Nandric, we are talkin about cartridges. You know, those silly things we clamp to the end of out tonearms.

miijostyn, I try to explain expressioon ALL as universal quantifier.

Experession ''some'' is unversal existential quantifier. t assuems

existance. But those are NOT NAMES which in ''subject place'' of

an sentence can be put as refering.expressions.

Perhapes ''some'' will do as in complaint: :''someone has stolen my car''.

If you knew who this ''someone'' is you would not use expression ''some''.

European commission decided thst ''ALL IMMIGRANTS HAVE THE RIGHT

TO ASYLUM PROCEDURE. Without consulting member  state HOW MANY

they are willing to accept. Merkel stated' 'we will manage'' without any

iidea about  the numeber (aka ''how many'') of immigrants. For this

purpose the so called NUMERICAL quanrifiers are needed. Say 10 or

50 mllion.etc. BTW Holland can't manage those immigrants because only

an smal part satisfy conditions for ASYLUM . Each country has rules

reg. treatment of strangers.

The ''best student in the class''  assume say 30 person in the class but

the ''best studenin the world'' can't be known.

The ''best cartridge '' is relational term because it imply comparison among

HOW MANY CARTRIDGES? Can you make any statement about cartridges

which you have never heard? Those are INCLUDED in ''ALL CARTRIDGES''

in this thread. 

I already mentioned in my post that this question can be only answered in

the context of ''my cartriges are ...and from them the one that I like the

most (aka ''is the best'') is ,say, Ikeda'' FR-7fz . Raul owns _+ 100 and

from THOSE he seems to like ADC26 the most. Capiche?

thread 

 

 

Does the "World's Best Cartridge" the term adopted by the OP, and the OP's references to their other experiences of substantially expensive Cartridges.

Suggest that in their assessment the Cartridges that are seen to be coming in $10/£12 - $25/£30 per replay, if using a 1000 Hours of user life is the guideline, are the Cartridges to be considered only as the 'World's Best'.

As most users of HIFi equipment buy in a price range they are comfortable with, most users of the Vinyl LP as a Source, would not be in a position to comment on such an item that incurs this type of cost.

I am well-Travelled in my attempts to experience new encounters in HiFi, where the creating a broader knowledge of the equipment used in a Vinyl Source has been the goal. 

In relation to having experienced a TOTR Cartridge from a recognised Brand with a growing reputation for their use of Technology, I will suggest the DS Audio Grandmaster used in a System that has approx' £200 000 is the most expensive Cart' I can put a price label on.

I have heard TOTR Cart's from other Brands and know I have heard Lyra's and Transfiguration Cart's in non-owned systems.

More interestingly for myself, is that using subjective listening an assessment method, carried out on non-owned and quite different built systems.                         I have not discovered a Cartridge that stands out as unique and must have, even though the possibility is for some, that they would not fit into a Cartridge Budget allocated by myself.

There are other questions as well, what actually qualifies a Cartridge to be given a Tile the 'World's Best' or even the Title 'Contender to be the World's Best'.

If subjective evaluation is to be the assessment parameter, as it seems to be for the OP, definitely for myself, and I am sure multiple others with an acquired experience.

The outcome of selections is looking likely to be quite varied across contributors.

One other criterion, that would also need to be added into the assessments being made are the control measures for the consistency of the report.

Are all assessments undertaken using the same supporting ancillaries?

Which prior experiences undertaken by the assessor, would deem the assessor qualified to make their evaluations being made known to the Public, to have any credibility.

Which would be the selection of supporting ancillaries for the Cart', to be used in conjunction with, are the ones that can be agreed on, to ensure there is a fair evaluation being undertaken.

Due to the function of the Cart', environmental impact can be considerably degrading to the Cart's function. Which are the ideal environmental conditions, to be present when making an evaluation.   

My experiences to date, have shown myself that the most engaging and desirable experiences that have proven to be very attractive, are when carried out in a home, where a system has been built over many years of devotion and the choices made for particular devices and their mounting, have undoubtedly been correct for the Set Up in that unique environment. 

I have been fortunate to have heard Cart's with values of up to £5000 in these types of conditions and have been thoroughly impressed.

In my experiences, I could quite easily live with a Cart' experienced from these encounters.

In my limited experience, it is not too easy to see where a Three - Fivefold increase in Cart' purchase value would offer a more engaging experience and stand out to the level where it justifies the extra expense, if I am using the recollection of other attained experiences of a more expensive Cart'.

I'm leaning towards @nandric assessment of the contributions and will add that in general the human has to offer some kind of purported reasoning for a made decision, especially when associated with the action of making a purchase that is encroaching on being one that is an absolute luxurious acquisition.             

pindac, I am talking about LOGIC of used  sentences or statement which

include ''universal quantifier'' you about ''price '' and old classical economist

terms ''value in use'' as opposite to  ''value in exchange'' (aka price). 

I assumed that we all question any ralation  between ''quality of sound''

and the prices for our ''gear''. Think of  Dover's praise of this cheap

Denon which cost only a half of ''only stylus retip''. I have no idea why

he offered to me only half of an glas wine. Should I visit him all the

way to (Dutch) New Sealand for such ''PRICE''?