End Game Turntable suggestions


Hello all, looking for insights to help me narrow down to some core choices; I am open to new or preowned. My system details can be seen under my profile.

In summary I have significantly expanded my vinyl collection and as of now I am looking to purchase an end game turntable appropriate for my setup. As you can see I use Mola Mola Kaluga Monos, and I really like the Zesto Pre and Phonostages. I find the class D/tube pre combination very pleasing. 

I would appreciate suggestions for around $5-8K (table + arm), new or used. I will have separate budget for cartridge. One preferred option (but not must-have) is universal voltage, as I may move the unit to Europe later. My current vintage turntable (Project Perspective) is 22 years old, and while I don't know how to compare to something really amazing, I can say that my setup is lacking detail and bass. The tonearm is terrible to keep aligned. Based on visits to Axpona and Cap Audio Fest and other research, I am thinking of a few in my budget, but will really value your suggestions of other brands:

- Origin Live Sovereign

- VPI Signature

- SAM Sinner

- Thorens TD 1601 (semi automatic)

Visual appeal is important to me (which is why Technics 1200 is not on my list despite great reviews everywhere). I love the idea of set it and forget it DD tables, but unfortunately mostly out of my budget (eg VPI HW-40 going for abt 11K used)....

Sorry for the long post but my hope is this background and help solicit good suggestions. Thanks

 

musicmatters1206

Interesting the air cushion bearing being referred to.

During the past 18 Months I have shared a few emails with an individual about works being undertaken on a Vintage TT, to improve on the OEM Performance.

Today at this end and their end similar things have evolved for the design.

A Bearing design being produced is to be a complete rethink of the original, and a step quite different to some of the email exchanges.

The design is now based on a Air Film as a separator at the interfaces between parts on the Bearing Housing.

I believe this new direction is now in practice, as my own and this individuals thoughts has been that a Hydrodynamic Lubrication is a challenge and will be difficult to maintain.

This individual also makes there own platters for the TT model, as an addition to this there is also to be a Mag Suspension produced in conjunction with the New Bearing Design.

Densified Wood is now adopted by this individual and they are giving it a High Appraisal as a Plinth material in relation to other materials used for a Plinth with recognised and valued damping properties.

Once you have experienced frictionless bearings in all dimensions, everything else sounds like a bad compromise. Air is the easiest way to do this, but you can do mag lev for thrust and air for lateral. It works just as well IME.

@musicmatters1206
If you like the look of the VPI Avenger, I purchased one used with rim drive and 2 VPI arms for $8.0k in 2019, so you may be able to find and afford.

VPI seems to be a safe high value high mass turntable company.  Their turntables are commonly used at audio shows, the company has a long track record in reliability and good service, and the company will likely be in business for a few decades as the company was taken over by the son Matt who has started a young family (financially handcuffed?).  

At 8k you can get an STST Motus table. Kills an Avenger. Kills most tables until you start spending double. 

Or rebuilt Garrard 301/401. If you're talking endgame, these are better long term choices.

@musicmatters1206 The Thread has been about your inquiry for suggestions to acquire an End Game TT.

In response to this, there are Options made known in relation to your budget, and around TT's proposed on your early days Shortlist.

The Thread has also gone a little of the usual path as there has been the suggestion of a Used or New Model, with the used option extending to the Vintage TT as a option.

What matters in a choice to be made is how the aesthetic stimulates and is welcomed into the home as a visualised item. 

'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder' so with this in mind, your eyes, your attraction to beauty. You've already revealed a Magpie Tendency and get drawn to a Shiny Blingy Item.  

What has also been made known is how a certain material or design aspect can leave a very very good impression when experienced. To the point that any previous Materials or Design are no longer wanted to be returned to.

As for materials used there is an aesthetic to be worked around and this might not be wanted to be overcome.

As for the Design @terry9 has made it known that a Bearing Design now in use, has proven to them that it is functioning in a manner that makes it much more attractive to have than older used designs.

There is a journey to discover a TT that is to ones satisfaction, I myself am on this Journey, I have my End Game TT, and am using it as a Model to bring it to a design that will be quite a tool for a LP Replay.

Servicing, Addressing Speed Control, Mounting of the TT ( ongoing ), Bearing Design ( Ongoing ), Platter Design ( Ongoing ).

Each of the Ongoing Investigations are able to take the TT to another level of performance.

With that in mind, and the knowledge that you have significantly expended on your Vinyl Collection. A similar curiosity and enthusiasm may develop for the Mechanical and Electrical Interfaces within yourself, where there becomes a interest in discovering where there are options available to eek out the betterment of the Set Up.

Some of this can be addressed prior to making a purchase, i.e, Speed Stability Platter Material, Bearing Design, Structural Materials.

There is no rush to make a Purchase, and having taken time to have studied and develop an improved knowledge of what makes a Mechanical and Electrical Device function as a Standout Performer is a worthwhile undertaking, especially one that will have a sizeable cost and will have a significance of importance attached to it as a Tool to be used.