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  3. 182927-125055

Why HiFi Gear Measurements Are Misleading (yes ASR talking to you…)

About 25 years ago I was inside a large room with an A-frame ceiling and large skylights, during the Perseid Meteor Shower that happens every August. This one time was like no other, for two reasons: 1) There were large, red, fragmenting streaks multiple times a minute with illuminated smoke trails, and 2) I could hear them.

Yes, each meteor produced a sizzling sound, like the sound of a frying pan.

Amazed, I Googled this phenomena and found that many people reported hearing this same sizzling sound associated with meteors streaking across the sky. In response, scientists and astrophysicists said it was all in our heads. That, it was totally impossible. Why? Because of the distance between the meteor and the observer. Physics does not allow sound to travel fast enough to hear the sound at the same time that the meteor streaks across the sky. Case closed.

ASR would have agreed with this sound reasoning based in elementary science.

Fast forward a few decades. The scientists were wrong. Turns out, the sound was caused by radiation emitted by the meteors, traveling at the speed of light, and interacting with metallic objects near the observer, even if the observer is indoors. Producing a sizzling sound. This was actually recorded audibly by researchers along with the recording of the radiation. You can look this up easily and listen to the recordings.

Takeaway - trust your senses! Science doesn’t always measure the right things, in the right ways, to fully explain what we are sensing. Therefore your sensory input comes first. You can try to figure out the science later.

I’m not trying to start an argument or make people upset. Just sharing an experience that reinforces my personal way of thinking. Others of course are free to trust the science over their senses. I know this bothers some but I really couldn’t be bothered by that. The folks at ASR are smart people too.

nyev
kota1
2,706 posts
 

@thyname 

Besides, even if he is gone, it’s OK. Cin Dyment (aka The Speaker Dude nowadays) can handle the entire forum single handedly

No system, no speakers, no credibility, that guy just argues.

Post removed 
prof
3,509 posts
 

One more time:


kota1,


Someone's high end acquisitions don't give any more credibility in terms of making technical claims about audio. Someone could own Magico M9 speakers and still be clueless about how audio works.  Also, there is no high end brand of gear that protects someone against the same bias effects that would occur for any other audio gear.


For instance, if you understood how the Klippel Analyzer System that Amir uses worked, you wouldn’t be raising the red herring of measuring the room. The whole point of that analyzer is to REMOVE the influences of the room to gain an accurate measurement of the on and off axis behaviour of the speakers! It's why it's a revolution - you don't need an anechoic chamber to get these measurements!  And from that, those measurements help predict how a speaker might perform in various rooms e.g. if a speaker sends a lot of ragged sound off-axis and you put it in a smaller room especially you are likely to get that mixed in the sound with reflections and it will sound poorer than one with even off axis behaviour...etc. Some speakers will be more finicky than others, and will also be less amenable to EQ or room correction fixes than others. ASR is literally following the best science we have on this!

andy2
1,575 posts
 

Measurements can only tell so much about the piece of equipment. At the end of the day you have to listen.

Measurements cannot tell if something sounds warm, bright, musical, organic, analytical, transparent, soundstage width/height/depth ... just to name a few.

cleeds
6,103 posts
 
prof

Someone’s high end acquisitions don’t give any more credibility in terms of making technical claims about audio.

That’s quite true.

... For instance, if you understood how the Klippel Analyzer System that Amir uses worked ...

Ahhhhh, but you make an exception for your favored shiny tool, for which I’m sure you’re willing to submit lengthy rationalization. Hey @prof, it’s clear you’re a smart guy. Do you not see your ill logic in this matter, or are you just funnin’ with us?

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