Thoughts About Turntable Upgrades


I hope everyone is having a good Saturday. I'm sitting here listening to CDs because at the moment my digital playback is simply better than my turntable. The Audio Mirror Tubadour DAC that I purchased a few months ago is simply outstanding when paired with my old Cary 308. This leads to my questions/musings about turntable upgrades. 

I got back into vinyl a few years ago and purchased the Rega P3 with a Pro-Ject Tube Box DS2 preamp as a starter kit. I upgraded the cart to a Denon 301 II, which was big improvement for me. Looking forward, I'm leaning heavily towards a Sota Sapphire. I want a US made table only because I'm interested in having a US based system. The Sota seems like a good fit because I value sound that is more laid-back and I'm looking for a table that will emphasize warmth, soundstage, presence, solidity. That's the best I can offer in verbally describing my goal. I'm frankly looking for something that will top the Tubadour experience! The Rega is good, but after a few albums my ears are a bit exhausted.

Here are my questions:

Do y'all have any thoughts on my leaning towards Sota? Any other recommendations? Is there any reason to start with a new preamp rather than a new turntable? If so, what are your recommendations? 

I'm interested in your responses to these questions, but also any other suggestions as well. Let me have it! 

 

rblondeau

I spent some serious seat-time with a Rega P3 outfitted with an Ortofon Blue 2M. played, first, through the phono stage of a McIntosh MA5200 and then, through the phono stage of a Luxman L-550XII, using Focal Aria 536 speakers and clean, well recorded vinyl. That experience was about as far from fatiguing on the ears as possible!

Keep in mind that Rega's TT design and engineering philosophy is predicated upon producing very light weight, low mass TTs with very stiff bracing. As such, take heed of what pindac is saying here. All TTs should be placed on rock steady, isolated surfaces; Rega more than most.

I'm not familiar with the phono stage or the cart you are presently using. If I had to guess, which I'm loath to do because I much prefer speaking from personal empirical experience, I'd say one or the pairing of both of them is the likely the culprit for the ear fatigue. Speakers are part of the pairing equation, as well, as these are the business end of every system. Everybody has to play nice together.

After further research into my TT quest, I eventually whittled down my choices to a Rega P6 outfitted with an Ortofon Black 2M and MoFi Ultradeck with MastertTacker. I went with the Mofi Ultradeck+M and couldn't be more pleased. If you're interested, there's a full review of it in Stereophile (and other places, of course) that, as I recall, Herb Reichart wrote several years ago. Basically, he came to the conclusion, at that time, that the Mofi Ultradecks+M was the best he'd heard under 5K. I'm sure SOTA is an excellent TT. I've just never heard one.

I'm not familiar with the DAC you are using. All I can say in this realm is that I've never heard any digital set-up, even those approaching 6 figures, that my ears preferred over a good, comparable vinyl set-up. This debate over whether digital systems are better than comparable vinyl systems is fast becoming the replacement debate for whether multi-thousand-dollar cables & connectors "sound better" than those costing much less. Sure, digital is much easier, much more convenient and doesn't require the care and attention that vinyl does (i.e.  clean records). However, in those direct, structured and controlled A/B shoot-outs that I've done with digital vs. vinyl, even digital systems costing much more than vinyl, I know what my ears like. Maybe it's all neuroaudiological. In the end, your ears will know that they like, as well. Listen & demo as much stuff as you can and let YOU'RE EARS be the judge.

@oldaudiophile

There are some long time members with high end systems that say that their digital is as pleasing as their analog. I don’t think that they claim that they are the same in every way and I’m pretty sure that all is source dependent. My system was not put together with the same level of expertise and my analog still bests my digital, but the digital was a better value and my digital sounds analog and quite musical to my ears.
I wish that more of the members would post their system in virtual system.

OP,

 

Congratulations on your digital end. It is still difficult to get digital to exceed vinyl in the price category you are in even today. Great work!

A Soto Saphire is a good choice. Also you can look at VIP. By getting a table in the $5K range you can be assured of a very large jump in performance. To get the full value you will probably need to upgrade you Phonostage. My rule of thumb is to spend as much on the Phonostage as the turntable. I have upgraded many times and a great (I like Audio Research) Phonostage is required.

If you do this, you are in for a real treat. But make sure this is what you want. If your vinyl stomps the sound quality of your digital end… well you could have invested that money in your digital / system and elevated it even more. It’s just a question of dilution. The digital end is the future… vinyl the past. If you love playing with vinyl… great, go for it.

check out Acoustic Solid out of Germany. I moved to them after a VPI prime 21 and am very happy with the build quality and sound quality. also $3k less money (for the model i got), better built if i was honest as well.

 

Acoustic Solid – Handmade in Germany (acoustic-solid.com) 

 

There are very High Quality CD's as there is High Quality Vinyl Pressings

Each are produced with the end Sound Quality being Optimised, as a result of the recording > embedding and production process put in place.

When a CD Source is owned, especially of the Calibre owned by the OP, I strongly advise anybody with a Source purchased, that is of the qualities of the OP's Type, to experience these select Source Recordings on their own system.

I listen to both Vinyl and CD pressing from producers that specialise in the production of the better than the usual recordings.

I have also been able to hear these select recordings on some occasions as Same Album Samples on either of the mediums.

I have also been able to hear certain Albums that are select recordings compared to mainstream releases.

I will 'state categorically' that these pressing do make a difference, there is a price difference, and it is this that is seen to be a sticking point for some. There is even prejudices seen occasionally toward select recordings, as a result of the retail price.

I reiterate my advisory to the OP, before throwing monies at a rearranging the Vinyl Set Up, have a spend on purchasing a few select recordings to be used with your CD. Hopefully a favoured selection of Albums can be discovered from the producers.

I don't see there will be a need to pursue Vinyl with a intention after this experience, as the monies needed will most likely Triple to some of the previous outlays already hinted at.

The Cary, might just become the device that is under the spot light to see whare an alternative can surpass it, especially when replaying those select recordings.

Do Remember, I am a Vinyl through and through enthusiast, who has become aware of how good CD replays are able to be over the past not too many years.

If you want to experience some good quality CD Recordings on the Cheap, search out Albums recorded with Q Sound embedded in them, there are not too many, but they are able to be discovered for reasonable outlays.