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Speaker placement Quandary

Where to begin here? My question is that in my experience with speaker placement I "think" that it is best to have your speakers well out into the room to achieve the best in soundstage width and especially depth? For example my Legacy Focus XD's are 6.5 feet into the room from front baffle to front wall. I messed with them quite a bit but never went closer to the front wall than that in fear of losing that well spaced out soundstage or emphasizing bass.. Imagery seems rather good as well. The "sound" comes from deep into the front wall not near the speaker plane. I see many listening rooms (in forum members setups, you tube, etc) that seem to follow this thinking and I also see some rather sophisticated expensive high end systems (in dedicated rooms so no WAF effect) that have their speakers just 1-2 feet off the front wall between the rear of the speaker. Is this an element of a different preference in listening? Wouldn't the soundstage become flatter? Is there some tonal advantages to this? I realize some speakers are designed to be closer such as some Wilsons and it seems many the the B&W's end up like this.  I understand that locating speakers is room dependant and a huge variable too. 

 

My speakers weigh 140 pounds each and I have them sitting on Via Blue decouplers so I cannot move them by myself and replace them on the footers, so I have not tried to move them closer to the front wall. Additionally they are rear ported and as I understand it's best to keep them away from the wall. 

 

As many of you have probably experimented with speaker placements, what have you found that gives you that nice expansive soundstage and imagery  in your rooms? 

Also is it more an issue with room modes too?

 

My room is 14w X 18L x 7H  My speakers are 6.5" out, 39" off side walls and 8 feet apart measured from center of front baffle.. My listening position is 9.5 feet (Of the side triangle measurements) from the front baffles and I sit about 4 feet off the rear wall. I have side wall treatments, rear wall diffusion, front wall diffusion and bass absorption. 

 

I am not really looking for placement suggestions unless you see a real flaw here. I just wonder how so many different configurations work so well regarding less distance between speakers and the front wall? Thoughts?

128x128fthompson251
ghdprentice
6,946 posts
 

Well, of course different speaker designs, as you said. Also the reflectivity of the rear wall and what is in between them, and how optimized they are. I see photos of your system, but those do not look like Legacy Focus XD speakers. So I am a bit confused.

 

I also think a lot of systems are probably not well optimized. It takes not only patience but good listening skills. It can take years to easily perceive holes in a soundstage.

From your description it sounds like the imaging in your system is not being constrained by the rear wall, because you have damped them. Often an undampened rear wall can truncate the sound stages .

Interference with a lot of equipment also can break up the image… I say this because of your photo. I am not sure if you had tried it, but I would try moving the equipment to the side, and dampening all the was to the floor… and the back lower corner. To avoid a huge investment to find out… I would get some cheap long interconnects to go between the preamp and amp. If it has a big improvement then invest in really good interconnects.

 

Recently I went over to a friends house who was working to optimize his system. I could easily hear the equipment hole… we removed the equipment and voile gone. I added a big stack of couch cushions on the back wall and the imaging improved a lot and back into the wall. I could hear the problems in seconds… and to his delight he could hear the better results immediately.

So, I’m guessing, different speaker designs, suboptimal setups are the most common.

newbee
4,767 posts
 

I have box speakers, ports on rear, 3way. My room is similar to yours except a bit larger in all dimensions and a 9' ceiling. Regarding 'depth of image' minimum distance from the wall behind them is 4ft. Best imaging is about 5'. Speakers 9.5' apart and 10.5 ' distanced from chair in a triangle set up. No commercial wall treatments but lots of drapes, bookcases, etc, strategically placed. 

Your present set up sounds good, on paper at least.  Before you move them consider that you might not improve imaging that much but you might experience some bass changes (for good or bad?). 

fthompson251's avatar
fthompson251 OP
369 posts
 

@ghdprentice If you look at the last 2 pictures in my Virtual System you will see the new Legacys. Side equipment is not an option for 2 reasons. Dedicated lines location and no room to the side walls to set up equipment. My system is ever evolving so that picture is not current, I have made more changes with cleaned up equipment racks and front wal diffusion. Are you suggestion some absorption behind the listening position?

 

I guess this isn’t going the way I thought, not really looking for advice for my system. I was wondering about the placement question others have experienced.

jl35
3,976 posts
 

Mine are placed similar to yours...mine sounded much better when I removed most of my room acoustic treatments (I had overdone that)...I also have dual subs, so do not have to optimize speakers for bass...just lots of variables and personal preferences...lots of trial and error...I put my speakers on furniture sliders until I found the exact position I preferred, then put the spikes back on...lots of debate about use of spikes too...

tablejockey
3,883 posts
 

Trust your ears.  

Even the Cardas calculator agrees

Speaker Placement | Cardas Audio

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