Have we lost civility and respect on Audio forums?

Familiar listening condition in a relaxed mood with our biases and listening in artificial controlled conditions imposed on us trying to eliminate some biases ... In the two cases we use the ears/brain  biases blind or not...

As i said in my post ...

I am not against double blind test, this would be stupid ... But they are impractical most of the times for most people ... Simple blind test is enough ...

 

No objectivist pick his gear by double blind test first... They read the electrical specs first ... They did not most of the times anyway double blind testing of their choices when the electrical specs are good, they bought it ..😊

You misread my post and truncate my sentence of his context : the context was THE GEAR CHOICES PICKING UP CONDITIONS...This is what separate these two groups..Not the acceptation or not of double blind test which is only here a rhetorical and ideological posture impractical to do anyway ...

No objectivist go buying an amplifier blinding his eyes in a store to pick it up ...Do you ?

he read the electrical specs and trust that first ... He listen after ...

I think that you are an "objectivist" fanatic by the way you read my neutral and conciliating answer to you and trying to distort it for the sake of your double blind test obsession ... ...

Sorry but for me objectivism made no sense no more than subjectivist taste as the main ways to create a system room with satisfaction using acoustics basic and simple blind test and ears training in simple acoustic experiment ...

Are you here for wise discussion as your last post suggested to me or are you here to impose double blind testing as the only way to pick the gear or testing it on all people here ?

Even Toole do not pick his personal system for his living room AFTER a double blind test ...He pick it as any sane individual by listening to it , reading the specs and thinking about his room acoustic content, geometry, topology and dimensions ...

I am pretty sure that he will not come here nullifying any person testimony as meaningless if not put on double blind test ... He is a human first not a scientist doing statistical studies 24 hours on 24 hours ...

Sound qualities can be defined by parameters but in these set of parameters, they are biases coming from personal history , Toscanini biases are not on the same nature than Toole biases or mine ... We use these biases, generally not in a laboratory to define what is human hearing in a general way, but for the enjoyment in a relax way or for our work habits with our EXCEPTIONAL way each of us to hear sound , deceived or not, with all the shade of grey between reality and illusion which is the "meaning" territory ...

Eliminating all biases , which is impossible anyway, may be at the end also eliminitating meanings , the ears is not a microphone but a subjective part of ourself, not a tool ...

Why is it impossible to eliminate all biases ?

Because the way we listen is with all part of ourself, we decipher sound as meanings for us with our biases acquired from the womb till today...

Only ignorant think that it is possible to listen without biases... Eliminating one bias as sight is one thing , eliminating all internal biases is impossible by the definition of what hearing is ..

 

We listen with our biases...

You are obsessed by the elimination of biases... I am not... I am interested by the training of my biases... As any musicians ...Occasional simple blind test is enough ...

Keep your double blind test as obsession , i will use my simple blind test occasionnally as test , and i will enjoy my biases ...

 

“A subjectivist use ONLY his ears to decide that a system is good or bad... “

listening with ONLY your ears means doing it blind. Some subjectivists do that and some don’t.

 

 

It’s always the extremists of any persuasion that cause the problems. The more people moderate and learn to respect and perhaps even learn from others who happen to not think exactly the same way about something, the better off we will all be.

I think narcissism or perhaps just mere selfishness tends to be the driving force. If you care about others, you will respect them and value their opinions. If they act like a yahoo, then all all bets are off. Everyone just be civil! IS that too much to ask? Apparently so. As was pointed out above, conflict is a natural thing that is a part of Homo Sapiens as well as most every other species on the earth that battles for survival. But Homo Sapiens have the ability to learn and maybe evolve? Or maybe not so much.  The jury is still out apparently.

I am wondering, using your own testing criteria / and methodology, just how we would draw a valid conclusion about your Las Vegas system being SOTA ?

BTW I think any constructive common interest or hobby like the pursuit of good sound tends to bring otherwise disparate people more together than the norm. That is a good thing! Just not all the way all the time.

Sports and sports fans are another good example of how otherwise disparate groups can be brought together.

All it takes sometimes is just one common interest.   The more the merrier.  Don’t let the politician’s divide you!