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New DAC issues

I have been on a steady system upgrade path over the last year and one of the last pieces to be updated is my DAC, a Schiit Gungnir Multibit. I have no complaints with it, but I am always in search of more and better. The majority of my upgrades have been a big success.

I recently purchased a new DAC that shall remain unnamed, I don't want to throw it and the builder under the bus, but it is about a 5x multiple in cost over the Gungnir. I have had the new DAC for four days now, and I have been playing it continuously. When I installed it, I simply unplugged the other DAC and substituted this one, so minimal change. Initial impressions were that it sounded pretty lean and the soundstage was not great, but I figured it would sound better after warming up. There has been some improvement, but it is not significant.

Playing music with the Gungnir in place, bass was plentiful without being overbearing, and very clean. With the new DAC, bass is almost an afterthought. The Gungnir presented a beautiful soundstage and my speakers disappeared. The new DAC presents a good center image, though smaller than the Gungnir, and the speakers are pretty apparent on most tracks. In general, the magic is gone from the music, there is detail in the mids and highs, but not a lot of life.

I expected a different sound of course, but I cannot imagine that this is the way a DAC at this level is supposed to sound. I think that the Gungnir is considered a warmer DAC, but the contrast in this case is extreme. I am wondering if there is either an issue with the unit or somehow a mismatch with my gear. It provides a 3V output vs the Gungnir's 4V, which may make it a little less lively, but 3V is not out of the ordinary.

The rest of my systems is Pass XP-12 -> Coda #8 -> KEF Reference 1. I am in between streamers right now and using my DigiOne/Pi with LPS over RCA SP/DIF. One could question the streamer, but it sounds great with the Gungnir. I had an Aurender N10, but I did not get along with the Conductor software and now have an Innuos Zenith on the way. Connections are all balanced with Wireworld Eclipse 8's, Acoustic Zen speaker cables and an Acoustic Zen digital cable. Power is dedicated and runs through a Furman Elite 20.

I listen mostly to jazz and lower levels and I have always had a full sound, however with the new DAC the system is no longer engaging. Thoughts? Can a DAC just be incredibly lean?

 

 

zlone
mikhailark
246 posts
 

DACs sound vastly differently depending on the chip they use (or being R2R without chip) as well as filter implementations. If it doesn’t sound right to you it does not mean its bad. I personally know that most probably I will not like DAC based on ESS but will like AKM or Burr-Brown. But it does not mean ESS is bad. Just not to my taste.

Also, make sure you ARE getting an upgrade rather than just paying more for brand name. Say, you are getting ESS 9038 over 9018 and not the same (or lower!) chip.

My DAC is now R2R which is the best IMO.

gs5556
1,234 posts
 

The Gugnir is designed by one of the best digital engineers in the business whose company does not have a dealer and distribution network to take half of the sales price, so a price based comparison is not a good metric. Sure, there could be something wrong with the new DAC but in most likelihood you simply have a better mousetrap in the Gugnir.

 

baylinor's avatar
baylinor
1,416 posts
 

There is nothing wrong with naming the dac. In fact it is a disservice to everyone here.

roadcykler
143 posts
 

First of all, you can't compare the price of the Schiit to your newer DAC because the newer one has had to go through a distributor and retailer with each level marking up the price.  If you double the price of the Gugnir, that would be closer to the price you'd have paid if it was sold at retail. Secondly, price doesn't always indicate quality. Thirdly, electrical components don't "break in" but our ears do get used to the sound. Claiming that an item needs the equivalent of 20 or more days, operating 24 hours a day to sound it's best is simply ludicrous and unprovable. I guess, like any other religion, maybe I don't have enough faith. 🙄

yyzsantabarbara
4,820 posts
 

I went "down" from a $15k DAC to the latest Schitt Yggi+ LIM. It was bit better than the prior DAC (more details). The LIM is a slightly rolled off DAC and did not work great with my slightly warm Yamaha NS5000. However, the same DAC on the slightly bright Magnepan LRS+ is incredible. I use a Sanders Magtech as the amp. I previously used the CODA #16 as the amp but moved that to the NS5000. The preamp is a Holo Serene.

There is a sweetness or juiciness to the LIM that is amazing with the LRS+. I liked that DAC so much that I bought the last available Schitt Yggi+ OG (discontinued) for my Yamaha NS5000. The OG has over 100 hours and sounds better than the LIM with the NS5000. However, I am not sure if that is the DAC for the long-term. The OG sounds good with the LRS+ but the LIM is my preference.

I moved the OG to my office and stacked it on top of the LIM. I put the OG with my RAAL VM-1a tube headphone amp. That is a killer combo and will stay that way long-term because I have a 10k headphone coming home soon and I need a killer DAC for that. The LIM was not my preference with the VM-1a tube amp.

As of now I have my Benchmark DAC3B + Benchmark HPA4 preamp + CODA #16 on the NS5000. It is rather good. Not as good as the OG but good until I figure out what DAC to get for the NS5000.

I am thinking of a Playback Designs DAC because the designer, Andreas Koch, is a star like Mike Moffet of Schitt.

 

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