I've never experienced instruments out of proportion to humans on any SET amp I've owned or heard at shows, or in other home systems. Now I do hear a certain sound stage difference between SET and push pull tubes or class a/b ss. SET's have this sense of bringing performers to the listening room, the others I hear myself more transported to the recording venue, no doubt this is a more up front presentation, may not be for everyone. Personally, I like both, wish I could afford and had the space for at least two reference system with these differing presentations.
Single ended = large images?
I'm thinking about trying single ended amps. Years ago for a short time I had Cary 805b monos. I absolutely loved everything about the sound, except that they made all the images very large... Which for me took away from the realism.
Do all the Cary 805 models do this? Not sure if the 211 option on the anniversary edition might be different? I saw a comment by Dennis had that the large image size was intentional and an artifact of zero feedback.
If that's just the way the cary amps are, are there other brands of relatively high power single-ended amps that might not present images in a large and upfront manner? My main speakers are Verity Audio Parsifal, which are only 89 DB efficient. I also have a six pack of REL G2 subwoofers. I want to preserve as much dynamics as possible while moving to single ended, which is why the cary amps are attractive to me... Meaty transformers and a fair amount of power. My room is 15x29 and I listen moderately loudly but not very loudly. Mix of jazz, blues, rock and classical piano.
I appreciate any thoughts and any recommendations of other brands that might do what I'm looking for -- that single ended magic without giant forward images. Pricewise I'm looking in the $4k to $7k range used.
Thanks
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Yes sns I think the "oversized" feeling and the distance perspective are one and the same. I don't like a forward presentation, and this perceived distance to the performers gives the illusion of size, to me. If all SET amps are forward-sounding, I should probably not go that direction. Does anyone know if a forward sound is just part of the territory, or if some SET amps don't have this? Decooney: I am pretty sure the caps I have in my v4 amps are Mundorf Supremes. |
@montaldo sure, I started with KT150s in my QS M120s. They have a little more top end and a little more bottom end compared to the KT120s. I came from Cary, EL34s and Triode amps too. For me, I will always favor that EL34 midrange type of bloomy sound vs something more analytical with just more detail and more bass. Mids for me is where the music is at. Guitars and Piano keys gotta sound engaging. I was never going to be able to find enough power with 300B amps. Cary FE 211s are massive amps, high voltage room heaters. If I had a large separate room, with more AC - I might have gone that route or maybe not. Too big really. Mike’s smaller QS Mid Monos with EL34s are short on power and drive for my particular custom 6ohm 92.5db speakers I built. So, Mike and I talked. He felt I might like KT120s more. Started going back through friends with CJs. and the CJ forums, they like the KT120s there too. I later realized KT120 might have been closer to what I like. Af first I did not like them. Tried them twice in fact. Next I then let them settle in about 100hrs and realized it was headed in the right direction. I had played around [a lot] with the small input/driver tubes on the QS 120s, similar to how some of the V4s are set up. I have the other EVO Silver-Gold non-oiler caps. Exact same ones Cary uses on their top shelf upgrades on the FE 211s and such. The KT120s paired with vintage 1960s era Mullard 12xx7 tubes or PSVane 12xx7s up front sound nice. Particularly so when paired with the upper end Mundorf caps. When the amp transformers get warm and saturated, the 3D layered effect occurs, sounds in front, across the front, up to the sides of me. One of my former Cary amps did that too with the same caps, but the QS M120s are cleaner sounding now after these mods. The amps transform with the right caps/tubes in them. |
Thanks for that great explanation. You and I are cut from the same cloth. I spent years with a cj MV-52 then an MV60 and totally came from EL34 listing paradigm! I value the mid-range over everything. If it's not correct I don't care about anything else. I have voiced my system around the v4s with the KT150s, and I think the rest of my system makes them a little more mid-range wonderful, but it may be due to system balance not due to the tubes. I just bought a shunyata Everest which opened up dynamics and clarity. I think it would be really interesting to try the KT-120 tubes. I will think about that! Not sure whether trying to upgrade from mundorf Supremes in my v4s is worth it? Thanks Stu |
One amplifier I know I loved was a vac Renaissance 30/30. Push pull 300B output tubes. It doesn't have enough power for my current speakers, but I've heard about 300B SET amps. I have to wonder how amazing they must sound. I'm going to research these a bit. Maybe they are all low powered. I have thought about a vac Renaissance 70/70 or 140/140, but the cost of 300b tubes these days is pretty daunting. The 30/30 and a shindo montrachet are probably the greatest amplifiers I've ever owned, from a goosebumps musical point of view. |
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