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VPI HW-19 Upgrade question SAMA or SDS?

OK, the upgrade bug has bitten again, and I know that ther are a number of folks here that have lots of experience with their HW-19.

I have a VPI HW-19 Mk III that I recently upgraded to a Mk IV with a TNT platter with an inverted bearing. Also, it has a sorbathane puck suspension rather than springs, and I've replaced the rubber feet with cone type spikes. The table dead level sitting on top of a 1-1/2"-inch thick maple top shelf of a very heavy flexi-rack. I'm using an ET-2 arm connected to my shop compressor with four stages of precision air-regulation with the final stage adjustable just before at the entering the ET-2. I just air-up the compressor's 30 gallon tank, then kill the compressor so that it won't start back up, and I can listen for hours (wife think that I've lost my mind every time that I do this, but that's another story). Also, I'm currently listening to an AT33PTG that I have come to really like. The phono section is a Threshold SL-10 upgraded with Black Gates throughout.

The Mk IV upgrade made a real difference from the Mk III. As I quickly found out, the Mk IV presents a fuller soundstage and better base than the Mk III platter/bearing. I view that upgrade as well worth the money, especially buying it used here on A'gon.

Here is my dilemma with funds being limited to purchase only one or the other at this time, but not both - at least for now.

What do you think would be the best upgrade for this HW-19? A new SAMA for $400, or a used SDS for $600 to $800? Used SAMAs never seem to come up for sale, but you can always find a used SDS on Audiogon. I think that there are at least three available for sale here as I write this.

Also, if someone thinks neither mentioned upgrade would be cost effective, and that money would be better spent with an upgrade elsewhere, please say so. I'm trying to keep my mind and ears open - for better sound!

Thank you!
forrestc
forrestc OP
114 posts
 
Thank you, thank you, thank you all for the great information.

I've sure learned a lot from this thread.
stringreen's avatar
stringreen
6,472 posts
 
Frogman... My point was that short term speed deviations can be/are very distracting/annoying, and that long term speed difference aren't important. Going back to the original posts that said things like lubrication, dynamic contrast friction, etc. are critical... no. I agree that if the table doesn't spin at the exact speed it is distortion, and naturally our goal is to eliminate/mollify distortions, yet, it is not necessary to constantly adjust the speed for acceptable/pleasurable vinyl reproduction. Regas typically run fast, and yet, they are valued and praised with justification.
frogman
7,463 posts
 
Siramazing, I recently bought a TNT MK5 (23 lb, acrylic, steel, lead) platter and bearing, and compared the platter only, to the original TNT platter (also known as the HW19 MK4). I say platter only because the wider diameter bearing is not usable on a HW19, and it is really intended for the TNT turntable that I am in the process of "assembling" from parts of various vintages that I have been buying from owners who have upgraded. Anyway, the MK5 platter is a definite improvemnet over the original 15lb all acrylic and lead platter, with better bass extension, and better overall clarity, if perhaps a little bit less warm. I can only surmise that using it with the correct bearing makes it even better. I mention this because in a conversation with Mike at VPI, he remarked that this platter is "as good as anything we make today". These platters show up for sale occasionally for a lot less money than the superplatter.

As far as the sorbothane goes: Listen first! Don't assume that the sorbothane is going to be better. I have switched back and forth between springs, tiptoes, and sorbothane suspension, over the many years that I have owned my HW19. All depending on which tonearm I had on the table, and wether the table was on the rack, or the wall shelf. Overall, I would say my favorite has been sorbothane pucks with short tiptoes on top. Cut the sorbothane as thick as will allow the top plate/armboard to be just below the top edge of the plinth.
ferrari
617 posts
 
A wee bit off topic here, but I have a factory built MKIV. Over the years the springs have compressed and finding it difficult to replace them. VPI no longer has replacements or the sorbothene replacements. I know can insert neoprene tubing into the center of the springs to correct. But would like to get other ideas on a remedy. Anyone have suggestions?
markd51
763 posts
 
Ferarri, Some have said the Foam Noodle Toys that you can get from a swimming pool store work, but I do know the stock MK-IV, with metal sub-chassis, and Platter are a lot of weight to support.

Some have used Carbon Fiber Pucks from somebody like Back Diamond Racing, other options might be having somebody machine you four Delrin Pucks, and compliment-supplement them with thinner sorbothane sheeting from someplace like McMaster-Carr? I am unsure if McMaster-Carr sells the correct diameter sorbothane rods, which could then be cut to proper height?

Ya gotta figure, if VPI could get this material, perhaps so can you from somewhere? Mark
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