2. analog
  3. 1296759668

How can anyone afford this ?

I consider myself a dedicated audiophile. I am 36(which I am guessing is a little younger than the average here) and single. I have been interested in high-end audio since I saw my uncle's Mcintosh and Threshold equipment for the first time when I was 5.
Since joining the workforce and saving a little I have always been trying to put together a nice system on a budget. I do OK financially(I am a systems engineer) but I do live in NYC which may put some of this into perspective.
Over the last 6 months I have struggled to buy(all used on Agon) a pair of Dynaudio Audience 42s and a Threshold CAS2 amp, Chang CLS3200, and cables(I haven't gone out[I don't have a girfriend], purchased anything else and really haven't eaten too much to be able to afford these and it is still a real stretch). I am using the amp with a direct connection from my CD/DVD player(Cambridge Audo Azur 540D...slightly modified[op amps, PS caps, bypass caps] that I have had for almost 10 years). A fellow has a Threshold FET2 series II(to match with the CAS2) he is holding for me but that seems like a pipe dream at this point along with a turntable.
A few years ago the analogue bug hit me.
I had a setup consisting of an Audio Analogue Settanta integrated and a Nottingham Horizon SE turntable with a Rega RB300 tonearm with the Incognto rewire and structural mod. This was not an expensive kit by any stretch but for me it almost put me in the poor house. I had to sell the entire rig to pay my bills and it hurt.
It seems over the last 10 years or so I have not been able to keep a kit for more than 6 months before I had to sell it. Whenever I don't have a rig I am constantly scanning the online Ads lusting for the next bargain to set up a system and cannot even listen to music on a mass market rig(I have been spoiled).
Anyway, I guess my question is how can anyone normal afford this hobby? What type of money do you have to be making to be able to enjoy this hobby.....$100,000/year? $500,000/year? Do you need to be worth millions? $5,000 barely gets you in the door(some interconnects cost more) and you could possibly spend millions. I am not looking to put together a $10,000 system(not even close...and that is modest in this hobby) but if I wanted to I don't see it ever being financially possible. If I had a girlfriend or a family(hopefully someday) I would not event be able to think about this hobby with a good conscience. I guess I am wondering if all these people in this hobby are millionaires? I am close to selling my rig again to pay the bills(the amp needed repair/recap and that was $450). Any advice for an audiophile who lusts to put together a nice rig but can't afford it? Should I get out and save for 5 or 10 years and then try again? Maybe I am in the wrong hobby but it is more addicting that crack to me(and more expensive). Maybe I should be a crackhead instead...that might be the only thing to make me forget about it. Thoughts?
adamd1205
ckoffend
684 posts
 
Is it better to be poor in the US or "middle class" in India, China, Vietnam, Mexico, slew of African countries, etc. . .? In most cases, the poor in the USA still live a more comfortable life than the middle class in many of these alternatives.

Even the poorest in the USA have safe drinking water, public safety, access to education, access to technology (free in most communities via schools, community programs and libraries).

Trickle down does not always come in the form of cash!

Just take a look at what our President has been promoting this past week - high speed internet access to all! The fact that this is even a topic of relavence says a huge amount about where we are.

For those that don't believe that trickle down works, take a look at charitable contributions and where (from whom) they come (the nice aspect here is that this is not government forced but individually selected for what is typically benefits of their community - whether seen as local, state, federal or the whole planet)? Take a look at the tax rolls and who pays what percentages of taxes?

I am all for incentifying the "poor" and assisting them in their efforts to get ahead. Many people need a helping hand sometime in their lifetime (not always financially) and I support those that have the capability to extend a helping hand to do so. We are all better off when our society as a whole is better off. Society as a whole is better off when all the individuals can sustain for themselves - through education, hard work and great effort.
mordante
511 posts
 
To be honest, and I may be mistaken but I realy think the rich in the US don't pay enough taxes. These are the state taxes in the Netherlands.

€0-19,000 33% tax
€19,000-55,600 42% tax
>€55,600 52% tax

and then there are also provincial en local taxes. To me this seems like a fair system. The average income before tax is about €33.000 in the Netherlands. I earn about that much. I strongly disagree with Manitunc, I think you live in a ivory tower.
blkadr
739 posts
 
Well, the fact is, that when the Bush "temporary" tax cuts went into effect, charitable donations declined. If they were left to expire, taxes would still be about what they were when Reagan left office (Reagan actually ended up tripling the national debt).
Does anyone here ever think about "the good old days, the golden years", maybe the 50s, early 60s? The tax rate for top earners was above 90%, and that included the Eisenhower years. These days, there are loopholes and off shore strategies that make the actual rate lower for those who can take advantage. Multi-billion profits in one quarter, and Exxon Mobile pays virtually no taxes.
No one is against the American dream, work hard and enjoy the fruits of your labor. But the playing field is not level, and the "redistribution of wealth" goes both ways. Power from money influences policies that help a small group of Americans funnel earnings to the top. But now hard working mid and lower class earners, white and blue collar, have been devalued, the spoils only going to the richest. There was a time when a skilled tradesman was appreciated and could provide a decent life for his/her family.
Those with means provide better opportunities for their children, nothing wrong with that. But millions of young people have never been given a car by their parents and sent to college. So many people get a job because they or their parents "know somebody". Simply stated, not all Americans enjoy the same opportunities.
If too much regulation makes an unfair socialist state, recent events teach us that too little leads us to financial ruin. Evidently the "invisible hand" that guides the economy tends to get a little grabby when left totally unchecked.
Since the Reagan years the country has been shoved to the right. What was once considered moderate is now called liberal. That is just a fact. The government looking out for the welfare of all it's citizens, not just those with power and money is not socialism or communism. There is a middle ground, not just a black and white choice between free enterprise or socialism.
mechans
3,048 posts
 
Man this thread went all over the planet.
I want to rant about something.
I am tired of those holier than thou people who insist this hobby should be about the music not what it's played on. Frankly then please do us a favor take your ipod and earbuds and enjoy.. you will save a fortune. Why even visit this site with its emphasis on costly gear costly for most of us anyway. This site is only in some part about music appreciation, but I think it is much more a site for people interested in sonic reproduction, improving their systems, buying and selling mostly "Hi End" equipment and talking about it. If you want to just talk about musical content there must be a million sites that concern themselves with that.
Like I said, just buy an inexpensive big box store reciever if you don't like earbuds get Bose speakers and play whatever it is that you want to torture yourself with.
To be sure though know this one thing. Gear does not need to be expensive to be good. It is not a money pissing contest for me.
I want what sounds good, the equipment is a critical part of optimizing my enjoyment.
Sure if your favorite tune gets played on a car radio of even as muzak your mind can fill in the blanks and you can enjoy it but again people wake up this is an AUDIO site meaning that which you can hear not only what is being played. Gumby GdDammit!!
End of rant now back to global politics instead of addressing this poor guys dillemna. I guess a shrink isn't covered by his insurance.
manitunc
795 posts
 
I'd be happy to discuss politics, economics and/or religion with any of my bretheren, but I doubt it can be done in this forum. So back to the original post. Yes, you can achieve most of the best for 5k, especially if you go used. Once you get the major flaws taken care of in the equipment, there is as much to be gained by setup, room treatment, etc as there is to be adding another 5k in equipment upgrades. The laws of diminishing returns always play a part, and to some extent, personal preference. I mean, what is the sound of an electric guitar ripping a riff? Depends on the amp and speaker its being played through. So for me, who enjoys classic rock, I need a system that can play loud, quick with full range and excellent dynamics. A string quartet listener might want something else, and dynamics may not be an issue. You have to get the basics right, and then start chasing the edges of what can be achieved.
More to discover