Cable "burning": Real or VooDoo ???

Albert and Redkiwi,

Both of you have made very sensible, intelligent posts. Mr 702, however, worships at the altar of numbers and you're not going to budge him.

Albert- your story about the racing boat reminds me of my checkered past when I was involved with fast cars. Cant' remember how many times two cars had identical bhp, torque curves, and drivers of the same physical mass. Yet when pitted against one another, there was always a winner. The hardline data types would say it should have been a dead heat every time. But it never was. Why? Obviously there was more going on there than the pure numbers would suggest.

Can we bury this already dead horse??

The problem now Albert and Redkiwi, Seldon and Sean on another post is that what ever this guy comes up with for equipment, assuming he does, will not be trusted by me. How after all this time can I believe he owns the equipment he'll say? His points have been make over and over, now he's come back with the same points, no new insight. His bed was made long ago, if we want to discuss his issues, let's start figuring ways to substantiate our findings, not for this guys sake, but to help study other products. First step is to stop giving this guy the value we have by simply not responding. I read through his posts last night on a number of topics, all the same crap. I will not waste my time talking to him any further and I suggest the same until he has something to offer. The ultimate insult to me was on the "Audiogon Recordings to die for" post. After so many great posts, all he was able to add was support to one disk. It was too much to ask that he add his own favorites to the thread. I hope it prides him in being the only blemish on that thread, maybe Audiogon will help by removing his worthless statement.

A $ (or euro) 0,02 "burned" vs. raw cable, blind testing experiment.
Unanimously, "burned in" cables sounded better overall: slightly more musical (I use the word as proposed in the posts following Detlof's thread on the subject), also, thicker bass, smoother vs strident highs, better imaging.

Story: Prompted by Sean's thread & the plethora of fascinating posts (thank you, all), I convinced the local Nordost dealer & two other audiophiles to conduct a blind A-B listening test. Dealer provided the cable info below.
Test cables: Nordost Quattro fil (IC). Burn-in: dealer's german machine (clearaudio?), allegedly 1 week + normal use, 1 week. Control cables, 4fil out of the box.
Test cables used between pre & power.
System parametres:
"Burnt-in" (dealer) quattro fil IC, spm ref speaker cables.
Sources: Clearaudio ref TT/Insider. Symphonic Line Reference CDP.
Amps: Symphonic Line Kraftquelle pre, RG7 power (also "burnt-in" according to dealer). A-Physic Avanti speakers.
Music excerpts: P Floyd "The Wall" ("...we don't need no educAItion..."), LP / Mahler 5th, Barbirolli (intro, ofcourse: those winds...), CD / Meet Me in London, Naim CD ("Caruso" with a female voice.)/Chesky's "Golden Ears" (Vivaldi's flute concerto, intro to 1st flute solo)
The 3-strong "panel" had 10 points assessment sheets, too, prepared by one who is a contributor to a local audio mag. (We tried to do this, seriously...)

What else? I had a great time playing audio reviewer, listened to the excerpts religiously and repeatedly for 4 hrs. It'll take some time before I listen to this stuff again (desintoxication).
Ofcourse, this was an informal experience that I thought of sharing with y'all as a small token to the posts above.

Cheers, Greg

My sincere thanks to Redkiwi and the others here that are as obsessed with the music as I am. I was afraid I would open this thread tonight and see a big bloody battle again. It is SO nice to see familiar names and sensible data posted on this subject.

I have to agree with Albert. Aside from a few posts that aimed for the jugular, i think that we were able to confirm at least ONE thing and do it reasonably civil. Most of the "regulars" agree and those that didn't agree still don't.

As an electronics tech, i can somewhat understand where some of these folks are coming from. It is hard for those that are "technically minded" and "electronically educated" to basically "renounce" or "dismiss" all of their education and background. As such, they will probably continue to believe as they do until they are shown differently or experience "changes" for themselves. I know that i used to think that a lot of this stuff was all "hogwash". First hand experience is HARD to deny, especially if the differences are quite obvious.

The funny thing that i find about all of these "wire debates" is that the "average person" simply listens and makes observations for themselves. While they are "uneducated" as to brands, specs, etc... or what to expect from specific models or designs, they can typically identify differences quite readily in MOST comparisons. On the other hand, those that are "electronically educated" seem to denounce any differences. Is it due to "preconcieved notions" ??? You can't say that this is the case with the "average person" as they have NO background or ideas as to what to expect from brand x or brand y. They simply have to go by their own judgement and what they experience first hand.

While i know that the "purists" will say that sighted tests mean NOTHING, i do not share that opinion for the above reasons. As such, i think that most people want to use what works or "sounds" best in their system, regardless of brand or design. If we are "normal" citizens, finding the best performer at the lowest price is something that we would all strive for. If that truly were the case, we would all own Pioneer, Technics, Fisher, etc... if it DID perform the same or better than many of the other brands that we do use. Seeking something "better" is what led us away from most of those pieces into the the components and cables that we use today. As such, we have "learned" much along the way in terms of hands & "ears on" experience. Like those that are "electronically educated", we are not about to throw away OUR "education" in these matters without being shown something different first-hand. We are simply the other side of the same coin.

On that "note", i'd like to say thanks to all for voicing an opinion and i hope that you enjoy your music and systems. Whatever they may be.... Sean
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