Say it aint so--- Teres quality question

Having been in sales for many years with a very well run company, it seems that about once a year I get a "transaction from hell". It starts out with a problem and each time I fix it, it seems to get worse! The only solution is to "over-manage" the situation and wrestle it to the mat. Virtually everyone I know that's in business has the same experience and Chris is probably no exception.

Patrick, I think you'll realize that Teres reputation here is pretty solid and that your situation is likely an aberation- honey will probably work better than vinegar in these situations. And Chris, keep 'raslin'!

Good Luck!

I debated on whether to post to this thread again because I suppose it is really none of my business. However, I will share what I have seen only because I don't want it to seem like Patrick is off his rocker, here, or anything. I was one of those to whom Patrick sent pictures of his friend's Teres setup. Patrick had inquired of me initially because I, too, owned an OL Illustrious and he had some questions about VTA adjustment. As it turned out, I had a similar situation with the Illustrious on a 'Not table (not being able to achieve an adequately low "ass-end" VTA setting). Actually, I could get just a hair under, but no more. My problem solved itself after I began using a Mat1 and its thickness allowed me to set VTA just right.

From the pictures that Patrick sent, it appears that Illustrious is as low as it can get, with the bottom of the pillar smack dead against the VTA collar and the VTA collar smack dead against the armboard. In this position, a picture of a lined index card shows that the headshell is just a bit lower than level (meaning up in the back). OTOH, Chris Brady says that it works fine on another 265 in his shop. This would seem to indicate that the 265 Chris is using is different than the 265 owned by Patrick’s friend. Is his plinth/platter overall thickness different? I dunno. I do know that looking at Patrick's pictures would give the impression that the only way to rectify the situation would be to lower the armboard in relation to the plinth/platter. But, I also see where Joe has his armboard up on cones whereas Patrick's friend does not. A significant difference? Again, I dunno. Again, I bring this up not to point the fickle of finger of fate but, rather, to explain that Patrick is not formulating bogus claims without what appears to be reasonable and logical evidence.

I sincerely hope that this gets solved to the satisfaction of everyone. If I were the friend I'd have been having seizures of withdrawl long ago! :-) I assume he has another table! Ha! And, as an aside, I must say that it is above and beyond the call on Mr. Brady’s part to personally fly out and get the table right. However, should it not be the owner’s decision with respect to who is in attendance at the “fixin”?

4yanx, I also debated about posting earlier on this thread because there is no sense beating a dead horse.

I am at a loss to explain why Patrick and I got different results with the VTA adjustment range. The 265 dimensions for all of the 265 are the same. This is why I was frustrated with the process. All of my data said this should fit and yet Patrick's evidence didn't match mine.

I will not mind at all if Patrick joins us when I setup the table in Boise. And like Zaikesman said I hope it will dinner rather than the alley.

I've stayed out too, because I figured it was up to Chris and Patrick (and the customer) now. But, as David said, I got the pics too, and I agree that in the pics I have, it looks like the board is too high, not leaving enough room for adjustment.

Now, I will say that when I installed mine (the first one, more like a "stock" 200 board) I could not get mine to adjust either. But, I found the problem, being I DID NOT FOLLOW THE DRAWINGS CHRIS SENT ME. I was all kind of pissed, because it happened at the same time this issue was unfolding. As soon as I realized where the problem was, I knew exactly how to fix it. And man, was I kicking myself in the ass.

When he sent the drawings, Chris stated in an email that they changed the height (down about 1//8") to make VTA adjustment easier. I just plain forgot, and built it to the old measurement. I was in the same boat as Patrick's customer. But, like I said, easy fix for me.

There is one thing I would like to point out that may have been overlooked altogether. When the platter settles, I do not think it settles to the same degree on every table. Mine seems to sit a little high, and others pics I have seen (objective here, pics only) SEEM to show the platter at varing heights above the plinth. Possibly because no two people are going to get the same amopunt of the same oil in the bearing. That 1/16" to 1/8" wil have a marked effect on VTA adjustment. Could this be the problem?

The cones are a different story. That's my idea alone. I tried it to compare sonics between identical arms and cartidges. And it does work, but requires a thinner board. So, I didn't put lead in it, just laminated it out of cocobolo. I really think it opens up the soundstage. The best thing about it other than the sonics is the fact that I have more adjustment possibilties than any other set-up I have seen.

That alone would alleviate Patrick's problem, and Chris, have you ever tried it? It would be interesting to see what you think about it. If any other Teres owner would like to try it, buy the cones and I'll make you an arm board gratis. I would for you too Chris but I figure you might wnat to whip up your own, if you decide to try it ;)

And again I agree with David, "And, as an aside, I must say that it is above and beyond the call on Mr. Brady’s part to personally fly out and get the table right." Great follow up for the owner of any company, and my hat's off to you, Chris!

Nice responses from everyone since this thread re-surfaced. It's great to see things progressing in a positive direction, presumably with a final resolution in sight. The following possible causes for Patrick's VTA problem all come to mind:

a) An air bubble was trapped during bearing assembly (due to oil on the bearing housing sides and/or the bearing shaft for example). This could prevent the bearing from seating fully. (Joe, putting too much oil in the bearing would not keep it from seating fully, the extra oil would just spill out the top. Trust me, I know!)

b) The platter was made too tall.

c) The dimension from platter top surface to the underside of the platter that rests on the bearing flange was made too thick. This would hold the platter up higher than spec.

d) The hole in the platter for the bearing spindle was too tight, preventing the platter from dropping onto the flange.

e) The armboard was too thick.

f) Gremlins.

I hope Chris and Patrick will get Steve's table running, have a nice dinner and share their conclusions as to just what happened.