Lamm LL2.1 Deluxe "DC Offset"?

P59teitel
I agree with you. But the fact is the dealer and their authorized technician do not want to do that. I am not in the position to forced them to do so because, having learn of their attitude from this 3 months struggle, I am afraid they will forced me back to take any consequences. May be, they do know that the real problem is not in the caps.

Lall
I can understand that you already spend your time and thought in considering to buy Lamm product. I spend quite a lot of time and reading some reviews before decided to buy it, and this is the product that I adore to own for at least two reasons: 1) It has good reviews from at least two reputable audio Magazine like The Absolute Sound and Stereophile, 2) Just like Whart said, it’s a one man company product that usually have its own reflection, taste and heritage of the designer. Actually I plan to keep the unit for last, such kind of collection unit.
I do not expect to experience this kind of difficulties and such improper attitudes. But this also gives us a very good lesson learns when contemplating to choose and buy a product.

Whart
I learn 3 important things from your posting:
1) You are very lucky live in NY area, and this gives you an advantage to have a direct contact with the Lamm where they also located in NY. Therefore, this is very easy for you to prove them whenever you experience or find some trouble with your Lamm equipments. There won’t be any arguments and debates on whose observation/finding is correct and whose is wrong, you can simply drop the unit and have them repair it. I can’t imagine if someone across the continent and ocean, with a big spending/investment on the Lamm equipments, experiencing trouble with their equipments…...
2) Your statement of “On occasion, the line stage and amps needed attention….”, give me an understanding and prove that Lamm equipment is not a risk-free or trouble-free equipment. Therefore, a good relationship and trust between the customer-dealer-manufacturer is of mandatory, otherwise people will get lot of bad experiences like mine.
3) “…trust Vlad to do the right thing and also understand why …..he prefers that customers work with his dealers……”. This drives me to concern on a) what if the customers finally getting frustrated from the way dealers treat them? b) what if dealers and their technicians do not know what to do when they facing unusual case, the case that only the manufacturer can handle and give a right and correct direction?. When you invest in the Lamm equipments, though they considered being a small operation, it certainly cost you a big money spending, and you deserve a very good and fair treatment.

Charles1dad
Indeed, I already spent about 3 months facing this difficulties, but so far does not see any clear solution from them……
Again, If I were Lamm, I will contact dealer and :
1) Give them clear understanding what the design of the unit is really.
2) Give them clear and precise instruction on how to observe, find and solve the problem.

Gr-Grin:
1. I'm not going to speculate on the dealer, because that would be unfair,
but I've had such a wide range of experience with dealers, good and bad.
On the 'good' side, I have one dealer who, with a phone call, will show up
at my house (sometimes with the manufacturer in tow), listen, bring over
loaner gear and handle repairs/trade-ins whatever, without my ever having
to lift a box or do more than set up an appointment. In fact, I've never even
been to his facility. On the 'bad' side, I've had dealers who are less
customer oriented, to the point of dropping stuff off on my driveway and
basically acting like it was my problem.
2. No equipment, in my experience, is always trouble-free. That doesn't
excuse defects, bad support or bad customer service, but sometimes the
problem is easy to rectify and other times it isn't; however, my bet is, lot's of
us on this board have had problems in our systems at one point or another,
and trying to sort it out is sometimes frustrating and upsetting, even if no
one is at fault. You should also know that my Lamm amps are very early
ML2 models and the L2 I bought was used and when it needed attention, it
was updated to current spec at what I considered to be a very reasonable
cost.
3. Even with cheap consumer electronics (like a $150 DVD player), I get
very annoyed if I think there is something wrong with the gear, so believe
me, I understand the frustration/upset even more when it is a high end
piece that is costly.
4. My suggestion is to have the dealer talk to Vlad about getting the unit
shipped to Vlad to evaluate- I don't know what that will cost or how long
that will take- assuming that it is an airfreight wooden crate like the Lamm
gear I have owned. I think trying to work with Vlad in a cooperative way
may get you some satisfaction, because in my experience, he has stood
behind his equipment and never charged me a lot when the gear needed
repair. (I assume you are still under warranty).
5. One other possibility- can the dealer come to your home, with his
technical person, and another amp, (and if possible another unit of the
Lamm preamp model you have) just to see what's going on? That may
not solve the problem, but may give you (and the dealer) a better idea of
what is going on. Also, because you said you were dealing with the free-
lance technician for the dealer, have you spoken with the dealer/owner in
addition to the technician?
Perhaps you've already done some of this. But, I never had any dealer
work on any Lamm equipment, and every Lamm dealer in the States
basically sends the gear to him for anything more than tubes.
Where are you located?

Whart,
After 3 months of frustration for Gr-gin I second your recommendation, ship it to Mr. Lamm.

This story does not appear to be happening in real time.

The dealer gets a lower measurement than you and Lamm states a lower measurement has been seen on one occasion which was diagnosed as leaking caps, which they offered to replace. You suggested the dealer's lower measurement was a function of AC conditioning.

What did you do to validate the accuracy of your meter? Have you taken your meter to the dealer to let them compare its reading with theirs in their context?

Have you taken your amplifier to the dealer to let them try it with another LL2.1 or different model Lamm preamp?

Have you observed the woofer problem replicated with any other amplifier?

Thus far it sounds as though Lamm is responsive and open in their correspondence and following their protocol. It is not unusual for them to supply repair parts to local technicians for installation.

Lamm sent a report of the build tests for your specific unit. Did you share those with the dealer? Does the dealer's test show a deviation from those results?

If your dealer has a Lamm qualified technician in their employ who can do the work and the unit is under warranty, what reason do they give for declining the repair?

Why is a third-party technician involved?

I think in such cases, action from those who pocketed the money for the new gear should speak louder than words. Why can't LAMM arrange delivery through his dealer of another pre to Gr-gin, and take back the "unsatisfactory" unit from the customer for some serious indepth testing, repair and outright replacement if need be?

I just cannot understand the behaviour and attitudes of manufacturers in such cases. What they have to lose through negative publicity needs to be carefully weighed in the decision of leaving the customer sob his heart out or regret his purchase ....

Remember there have been reputable audio manufacturers driven out of business through their own inability or unwillingness to support customers in difficult times as these...

Why should the onus always be on the customer? Why can't the manufacturer or his appointed dealer make a commercial gesture and at the same time create a goodwill... What will this cost to the manufacturer?

After this ongoing saga of unresolved issue one thing is certain, no LAMM product will ever enter my audio room..... that's it.