I'm a little perplexed/surprised by TMR and who sells to them.....

My man you got that Right...insane prices.They buy then and then want to resell them at prices that are now...On Sale if bought new.This is not the Stock market it is used equipment....and your not test driving it or having it checked out buy your prople...your taking there word for it....Well if your buying something in the 100,000 Ranger...Buyer Beware. 

@troutstreamnm 

McIntosh is often mentioned as the standard bearer in terms of durability, serviceability and resale value. I don't own McIntosh gear.

I bought one piece of fairly high end equipment from them.  I was treated fairly and the transaction was smooth as silk.  I also traded a piece of fairly high end equipment for another (a little higher end).  Again smooth as silk.  Could I have sold my piece for a better price than they offered.  Sure.  But they took all the pain out of the deal.  I would use them again.

They just put up a YouTube video walking you through their operations; I found it very interesting indeed, in a positive way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAP0gCRKZuw

Let's look at it from the buyer point of view:  The buyer gets 1. A smorgasbord of what's available to pick and choose or not.  2.  A thoroughly checked, fully working item.  3. No concern that after paying their $, will some guy at the other end of the country actually ship the purchase.  4. No worry about aggravation if the shipped item is damaged in-transit.  5. Buyer knows he is dealing with someone who has a reputation to protect.  6. Buyer is buying from a known trustworthy seller.  7. Multi-month guarantee.  8. Buyer knows that even if they are paying a bit more, they are getting all of the above.  9. It is certainly cheaper than buying new.  10. Peace-of-mind. 

What makes sellers do such a crazy thing?

Have you ever bought a sold a car from a dealer?

How do you think business works? Is the reseller supposed to give you something near what you paid with just a little shaved off because your amp or streamer or turntable is so exquisite for having been owned by you? And what do they do when they have to sell it?

Take your eyes off of the navel.

I've bought a couple pieces from them and it was fine. They def end up being on the expensive side due to a) an initial high price as compared to private sellers, plus b)sales tax and more recently c) very high flat rate shipping.

I tried to buy the B&W sub they've had listed on and off since February last week. It's an expensive, odd ball sub that is only controlled via a B&W app which could lose support at anytime as B&W has changed hands every few years over the last decade. They slightly discounted it and insisted on charging $400 for shipping from CO to me in NY. I'd just sold and shipped two similar sized and heavier JL subs further west of CO for $130 each- insured. The $399 they were charging was absurd. Flat rate, when its hugely above actual cost isn't a fair model in my opinion. The combo of the 8% sales tax which was about $260 plus the unnecessary additional shipping cost of $270 on top of the actual $130 shipping cost made the purchase over $600 more than it should have been. I bought a pair of REL s812 from USaudiomart and moved on. Days later I saw that TMR marked down the B&W sub slightly again. Had they just moved another few hundred dollars on the total price for me it would have been in my living room instead of still in stock and being marked down. I also felt the salesman I was working with had no decision making power and was taking hours between emails to get back to me after having to check with someone on every question. It gave me plenty of time to continue to look elsewhere and ultimately buy the REL (with no tax, competitive shipping and fast transaction process).

When TMR buys an item outright and pays you when they receive and inspect, they can then sell for whatever they want...somewhat different when they take on consignment and seller gets percentage of actual sales price...the salesmen I've dealt with have been knowledgeable and quickly decisive...

I have dealt with TMR twice recently. Both times were great. I was selling a turntable that when they received, there was an issue with the motor not keeping a constant speed. They said it was taken care of by their tech and no charge.

As far as the issue with 1099’s I was advised that the threshold had been changed back to the $20,000 and 200 items sold before one would be issued at least by eBay. Not sure how other establishments would report unless it is up to you to self report!!!!

You say "The same sellers who list their used gear for 30 or 40% under MSRP and refuse legitimate offers from qualified buyers" these legitimate offers are very often insultingly low offers and I get tired of it and I always list my equipment at a reasonable price. I won't give low ball offers because I don't want to insult anyone but boy it sure seems like most offers are and that's what makes selling to someone like TMR so tempting. I've sold to them and I've bought from them,they are very easy to deal with

Hey saugertiesbob,

I own a pair of those really fine B&W subs and paid my excellent dealer 10% off of retail. My system is low six figures, most bought at high discount.

The room compensation software is world class and those subs may be the highest quality product they sell.  

Worried about B&W going out of business?  They are one of the largest, longest lasting companies in the industry.  Doubt that you own anything from a more stable company.  

Good listening...

I have done business with this company for years at the start it was very good fair price for trades good deal on purchases. Now that they are successful it’s more buy low sell high.

Overhead? What's overhead? Smdh

Don't like their business model don't use it, or you just want to bitch? 

They also offer to sell your gear for you with their consignment program. Should you prefer that. 

Sold a couple REL subs through consignment with TMR. The process was painless and I netted an amount that is good enough considering what I originally paid for them.

TMR doesn’t get consigners top dollar but it does list items at above typical market value. Apparently there are many willing to pay a premium for that option to return an item. 

TMR is a business that provides a service of selling for you, so I’d expect it’s more expensive than selling yourself.  This service is not free, and many use their services.  

My only issue with TMR is their rating practices.  They tend to overrate the condition of their gear.  For instance, they will routinely list gear for sale on Audiogon rated as 9/10 and then describe said gear as very good but go on to show marks on the face of amps or front baffles of speakers.  So their 9/10 is my 7/10.  As such, I look very, very carefully at their pictures and take their overall “condition” with a giant grain of salt.  Basically, I don’t consider buying anything from them unless it is “exceptional” and even then I have received one item before that had a mark (albeit small) on the top plate despite being described as exceptional.  YMMV

As one who owned a high end audio video dealership and was generally loathe to take in used gear, even if it was purchased from me weeks before, used is used. Period, one month, one claimed hour of listening to ensure it was “ working flawlessly”, it’s all the same. Used is 2nd hand and usually that voids warrany. Even if not, same thing. It’s worth the same, generally 50% off list. Anyone who thinks differently is an arrogant fool. No one cares if you’re a verified” anything. In fact the more gear you go through publicly trade on the web, the more not less suspect your mindset is! Now to your issue, do you expect a dealer to make a profit giving you 50% off? TMR is a DEALER, not some dude in his man cave. It’s a money loser at 70% off list.! New a dealer flat out loses money passed 25% off a legit customer—a guy who walks into a shop in NYC not the a-hole who uses the dealer’s showroom and then calls around looking for the lowest bidder. You deserve 0 support if you’re that guy. Do you think lights, real estate, utilities, building a showroom, salaries, commissions, inventory ( it’s taxed twice a year which is why retailers in particular try to get as close to zero inventory when taking it arrives). So after all that, frankly anything much below 90% of list is problematic. When you go to a car dealer, do you expect to get the same selking versus trading to them? Who would you feel more comfortable buying used from me or TMR? Pennywise pound foolish. So, if you are taking an attitude, maybe you should ask your question out of ignorance rather than saying their raping me and i should get more for taking the short road. No retailer makes “big” bucks. Revenue is a stupid metric. Businesses exist on on profits. And Used is not TMR’s main business, but i have no doubt it brings physical customers in their door. And they are a blip percentage of the secondhand market.

TMR for the most part is pretty awesome.  If you are selling big speakers and don't want to deal with the shipping hassle, they are a godsend.  They pay shipping to them, they schedule the freight shipment (if needed), they pay you F&F when the item sells, they deal with any customer returns (you still get paid even if the customer returns it).  Last time I they even shipped me a pallet and straps for a speaker shipment at no charge.  I sold a fairly esoteric amp through them a few months ago and it sold for much higher than I was expecting.  Their 35% cut of the consignment is a fair price to pay in many cases.

I have not bought from or sold to TMR, but I suspect it is growing in popularity as a buyer because of the aging demographic trend of audiophile hobbyists. When I first got involved in this hobby twenty years ago, lugging large, unwieldy boxes that often weighed more than 80 pounds to FedEx or from my building’s mailroom was easily doable. I practically thought of it as a de rigueur aspect of the hobby that was necessary to find bargains and sell them at a minimal loss if they didn’t float my boat.

Twenty years later, my ability and willingness to do what I used to do, e.g. driving to the next state to pick up a 90lb VAC Phi 200 from a seller or carrying a similarly heavy Plinius amp to FedEx a few days after buying it used, are gone. Thankfully, I’m very happy with my current setup, so I have been fairly inactive in the hobby for the last decade. But I can understand the appeal, especially among older audiophiles, of selling to TMR, which takes most of the legwork out of selling used audio equipment.

I rarely post, just lurk, but I wanted to post in support of TMR.  I've bought a couple of things from them.  Both times made reasonable offers (ie. not low-ball), and they accepted both times.  Both pieces were received well boxed and the condIition was as described.

Their business model is THEIR business model, whether one thinks it's reasonable or not.

If you are a buyer, you have the choice of buying equipment "X" at whatever price (and you can make an offer that can be accepted or rejected).  As a seller, you have the choice of selling your equipment at the price they offer (and you can negotiate that as well).  If you're a consignor, you can accept or reject their terms.

Their model allows for buyers, sellers, and consignors to avoid the time, hassle, and potential exposure to scammers.  These days, the issue of scams is extremely pervasive, and is very high on the list FOR ME.  One can decide for themselves what level of safety and convenience is worth any 'loss,' or extra expense, and proceed accordingly.

I’m greatful for the feedback.  My goal for my post was to do some research on “price discovery”.  I have long held that most sellers hope and pray for the greater fool.  My suspicion, confirmed by the overwhelming response in favor of selling to TMR, is that used high-end gear is worth 1/3 or less of retail. 

I recently sent in a request for my 2 year old anthem mca-525 amp not being used in perfect condition low hours, the price they offered me was highway robbery, I sold it for 68% more on ebay than TMR offered me. They are in business to steal your equipment, turn around and mark it up almost double...

I have purchased several high end amps from TMR and must say they have a great sales program, 90 warranty, great packing, fast response, great communication, highly recommend to buy from, but not to sell to, unless your desperate for cash.

Does TMR offer good money for desirable equipment?

The best option for TMR is to trade for some of their better gear. You get a better bet deal that way than outright selling to them. They will work with you. And as someone has said, they will come down on prices when they bought low. And what’s best is their quality control, guarantee, and return policy. I “sold” them a player that was perfect for CD but would not play SACDs. They got it repaired for only $200 which was great for both of us. My only complaint was over a sales guy that took too long to get back to me and I missed out on  a turntable I wanted. But nevertheless I would use them again and recommend TMR. 

@devinplombier - I guess that would depend on your definition of 'good money', which might be different for each person, but in my experience, I've been offered what I consider quite reasonable money for desirable gear, especially as they pay for shipping it to them and arrange for pickup, and I know I'm dealing with a professional organization and not just 'some guy on eBay'. Good to know in case there's a problem, and peace of mind is worth something.  

Hi, I live in the Denver area, so I can pick up and drop off my items at their location in nearby Erie, CO. I save a ton on shipping, particularly if the item is heavy.

So far, I have sold to TMR: two preamps (ARC and Mytek), three sets of mono amplifiers (PS Audio, Boulder, Clayton), a stereo amplifier (Spectron), a pair of speakers (Thiel), an FM tuner (Magnum Dynalab), a DAC (PS Audio), and a headphone amplifier/preamp (Pass Labs). 

So far, I have purchased from TMR: Internet Media Tuner (Magnum Dynalab), a DAC (Chord), a streamer (EMM Labs), and a preamp (Audio Research), and several sets of RCA interconnects (Audio Quest, Cardas).

Thinking back over these 15+ transactions, I have only had two issues: The 30 year old Thiel speakers that I sold had a minor age issue with the tweeter surround. A replacement pair was sourced from Coherent Source Service (+1 to Thiel owners group) and TMR installed them before they were sold on to a new user. We agreed on the price/cost in advance and we both were satisfied. The second issue was a partially defective digital output on the MD internet media tuner that I discovered after purchase. (TMR offered to fix it, but I chose to re-negotiate a lower purchase price). Again, win-win.

So, I am a committed repeat customer of TMR. I recognize that I might get less in trade, or pay more for a purchase, but it is worth it to have transactions that are safe and hassle free. BTW, I have been scammed on audio gear in the past, so a safe transaction is something that I recognize has value for me.

I still will selectively buy audio gear from other sources, but I either want to see it in person, or really vet the seller.

YMMV.