Update from Nordost Heimdall to Frey speaker cable

I initially started with HEIMDALL in a prior system on the belief that it was the NORDOST model “sweet spot”, and then drank the KoolAid for an upgrade to a full FREY cables loom

MY TAKE:

IMO that experience in audio improvements moving up from the HEIMDALL to the FREY are as follows:

(a) Firstly, the audio performance uptick was slight / small incremental in general, but certainly not any Jesus moment …. and in hindsight, simply not worth the added cash outlay.

(b) if I was still married to NORDOST cables in my system and somehow looking for a meaningful performance upgrade, I would go straight up to the VALHALLA ….and just skip everything in the middle cable models..There is a good reason why NORDOST VALHALLA and CARDAS CLEAR are the two largest cable options selected by the exhibitors at the audio expos.

(c) Without prejudice to (b) above, the main audio improvements from HEIMDALL to FREY were only gleaned by going the full Monty as a cradle-to-grave full loom upgrade ( ALL of IC, speaker, & power…) to an entire matched NORDOST model full loom .For example, If you think that upgrading just the current HEIMDALL speaker cables in isolation will favourably stir your drink, you may be disappointed.

(D) Further, any NORDOST cable upgrades are entirely VERY system dependent … more so than many other premium brands . You might see audio performance changes but be prepared that they may not be for the better. For example, when I upgraded to new HARBETH speakers, my full current FREY loom carry- forward frankly now sucked, and sounded very “edgy”. and “brittle” and fatiguing at a minimum . A full FREY loom change was undertaken to a full CARDAS CLEAR loom as a necessary upgrade with improvements that were not insignificant.

Choose wisely.

PS  NOTDOST  V2 cables versus the prior V1 models

My personal take , the prior V1 is 95% of the performance quotient of the V2 at a fraction of the price. There are similar personal experiences posted in different audio forums that comment in like manner on this. 

@akg_ca +1

Cables are so very system dependent, an extended audition in home is necessary. It just can’t be accomplished at the dealer.

That said, I did make an initial determination between Transparent, AQ and Nordost at the dealer to determine the “house” sound of each brand. It helped that the dealer carries my speaker (though not my electronics.)

What i wasn’t able to do unfortunately, was audition the reference level of the three brands, or anything beyond what my local dealer carried.

So, I’ll always have to wonder if I’d prefer reference level Transparent or AQ.  Fortunately, I’ve lost my appetite for that comparison as I’ve told myself Valhalla 2s should be end game. 

To @couger4u don’t let us discourage you from exploring Frey or Tyr II speaker cables. They are certainly very good and may indeed provide the results you hope for. Yes, there is always more, but it is certainly a diminishing returns game. Just be aware that if you don’t necessarily like them, it may be that it’s not the speaker cable you actually dislike. I could be that it is just potentially revealing other choke points in your system. Hence, the fun and/or frustrating part of this hobby.

I hope you come back to this thread to let us know how it’s going.

Best, 

I compared Tyr to Tyr 2 XLR cables. Tyr is a fast and detailed sounding interconnect but can sound slightly thin. Tyr 2 maintains all the best qualities of the original but is rounder, more organic and has better definition in the low end.
I now have two Tyr 2 XLRs - DAC to preamp and preamp to amps.
I had AQ power cables  - Tornado and Hurricane. I now use Frey 2 on streamer and DAC and Heimdall 2 on preamp. Much prefer these to pretty much anything I had in the past.

I’m currently using Audience AU24SX speaker cables but am curious to try Frey 2. Have been looking for a used set with spades (my speakers don’t eat bananas) and no luck so far. 

You'll hear a difference because you expect to hear a difference but there really isn't any difference (except an even more exorbitant price). 

@roadcykler 

are you actually suggesting that there’s no difference (other than price) between any cables whatsoever? So, you can use the cheapest lamp cord (or even smaller gauge - no reason to waste copper) and you’re good to go for speaker cables?  

Same for $5 rca cables to connect preamp and amp?

I’m not trying to be snarky - though I get that you’re comfortable with that tone based on your response here and in other threads. I’m actually trying to determine the limit of your observation(s). If expensive cables make no difference, can you go with the lowest cost denominator?  And if not, then what might be the threshold for you?

There are easily measurable differences in conductance, inductance and capacitance among cables. Further - all cables are antennas of some sort - both broadcasting and receiving.

Claiming diminishing returns I understand and I’ll claim the same. However, claiming no difference just isn’t factually true. Differences between poor quality and good quality cables are plainly audible. Differences between two sets of quality cables will be less so, but still audible. 

Many here claim audiophiles exhibit confirmation bias. And, that’s understandable because it truly is a thing. I’m sure many of us (me included) have exhibited it. But the existence of confirmation bias does not mean that no differences exist. It means that we may be predisposed to like something. I’ll acknowledge that it may cause us to conclude we heard something not there, but I would counter that some differences are so easy to hear as to be obvious from another room - or to my wife walking in and asking “did you change something?” without foreknowledge. 

So, I’d politely suggest that if you really hold the view you do, fine, but it’s unnecessary for you to post in a thread where others are attempting to explore ways to improve their systems and are seeking well reasoned opinions from others who may have direct experience to share. I’d gather you do not fall in that camp.

Peace.