Advice for speakers under $4K for mixed use

A used pair of Thiel CS2.4 ($5000 retail, $2000-$3000 used).

"The Thiel CS2.4 is a great loudspeaker, one of the very best I've heard regardless of price. Its treble soars and its bass plummets, but all the while the CS2.4 sounds utterly neutral and musically communicative. This speaker looks gorgeous and has the earmarks of heirloom-quality craftsmanship."

Soundstage!

PSB Synchrony One $4500 retail:

"Furthermore, the bass wasn't just deep, but well controlled, super tight, and without any boost or emphasis in the upper-bass region (100-150Hz or so) that gives the illusion of really deep bass when it's not there. The One delivers the real thing -- nothing I heard in my room would cause me to dispute the 30Hz specification."

""However, something I didn’t expect from the Synchrony One impressed me far more: the level of midrange clarity, detail, and tonal accuracy."
Soundstage!

I really like the Thiel sound (or lack of sound) but there are a lot of good choices in the $4000 price rang that I am sure other people will chime in on. It is best to get out and demo speakers.

James63 is right, best to get out and demo as much as possible. Here are two that you might like.

Von Schweikert 4JR or 4SR
Devore Fidelity Nines

add in B&W models (CM9 and the next one up?), PMC (Gb1 I think and the next up), Pro-AC seems to be well thought of. Aerial 6, some of the Salk models, some of the totems, and I'm sure others. Note I just trying the think of small footprint floorstanders (the b&w's are dodgy on this list). Of these I really liked the PMC units. leaves money left over for cables and stuff.

+1 on the demodemodemodemo and pretty much all listed in above posts.

p

Joseph Audio Rm22 or 25

A used pair of Vandersteen Quatros would be a superb choice
we have installed many of these phase and time correct design also featuring room compensation.
The Quatros perform with full range performance with genuine bass to 25 hz and maintain their balanced dimensionality even in corners inches from the side and front walls with amazing results.
Cheers Johnnyr

IME, Thiels need huge power to show what they are capable of. I doubt that the AVR you have has enough juice for Thiels.

I think the Josephs are an excellent alternative.

The Quattros would work well, since they have powered subs in each speaker. Finding a nice pair used for $4K is not impossible, but may require some patience. Also, you will forfiet the dealer install & setup you get when you buy new, so be prepared to spend some time dialing in the bass.

I have a combo 2-channel/HT system myself. Please check my System link. I am really enjoying my Ohm Walsh 2000s ($2800/pr) for both music and film. Note that before I was able to order the center (and after I had sold my old center), I used the Ohms in Phantom Center mode. This worked quite well, although I am glad I have added the matching center channel speaker. The Ohms also like a lot of power, but if your room isn't too large, your AVR should work. My 2000s are 9" square with a slightly larger plinth.

Marantz is 8x140. Will that be enough power?

Enough for what? For efficient speakers in a moderate-sized room? Sure. For a huge room and innefficient speakers, probably not. Keep in mind that most AVRs typically cannot deliver their rated power, full bandwidth, with all channels driven. The more channels you drive, the more the power output per channel drops. A powered subwoofer(s) will reduce the power demands on your AVR if the speakers are high-pass filtered.

I can second that the Thiel CS2.4's are a very fine speaker and require a good strong amp of high quality to really sing. Only after I spent more on amplification than paid on the speakers "new" have I heard it to it's full potential. Try and listen if at all possible and good luck! PS. The factory just sent out an email saying it's raising the price like 1k more pretty soon

I also own a pair of 2.4s and while they do need a solid amplifier (no pun intended lol) to sound their best you can get away with much less. I have tried 3 amps on the CS2.4 at this point. Mcintosh 252 (250 watts/ch class AB), Wyred 4 Sound ST500 (250 watts/ch class-d), and Rotel RB-1072 (100 watts/ch class-d and part of my second rig in the bedroom).

I liked the Wyred for sound the best over the Mcintosh 252. It gave up nothing to the Mcintosh 252 and added bass control (slam/punch). But I pulled out the Rotel just for kicks and it too does a pretty good job. It is not as refined in the top end or mids as the ST-500 but it does pretty good at only 100 watts and much better than you would thing for the $500 I spent on it...

As the people above have commented room size and seating distance are very important as to how much power you will need. Things like hardwood floor vs carpet make a big difference too. But most of all it comes down to how loud you listen. Remember that it takes twice the power for a 3db increase in sound. So if 20 watts gets you to your listening level a 100 watt amp will give you about 6db of overhead. There are a lot of factors but the doubling of power for 3db gain is a good place to start from.

I listen right around 75-80db and on the Mcintosh 252 (it has a rough gauge) I was using 12 watts with 20 watt peaks. Of course this will very with preamp gain, room, etc.

Now there is a theory that more power adds speed and control and there is some truth to this idea IMO. But there is a point where watts to not mean much and quality quickly takes over. Other things to consider are damping factors of the amp for bass control. Speaker impedance balance also matters. Anyway sorry to run on and on. I am sure you already know most of this stuff.

PS. I personally would alway buy the speakers I like first and work the amps and front end around them. Speakers will most likely be the weak link.

Silverline audio are fine speakers in that range used. Currently one Sonata mkiii is listed. I sold my LaFolia's for 3,500 (too cheap as it turned out).

If you want to go a step up you can get Revel Studio's close to that range (I paid 4K for mine used, but that was a killer deal).

From what I personally listened to I really liked the Joseph Audio line as well.

Funny, Edorr. I was going to suggest a pair of Sonatina IIIs, which list for $5K, but could probably be purchased from Silverline direct for less. A check of the Silverline web site revealed that both the Sonata and Sonatina have been dropped. Along with the Allegro being dropped, this means Alan Yun offers nothing between his $1200/pr Prelude and the Bolero, @ $12K/pr. It looks weird to me. With almost no distribution and no way for most people to audition Silverline products, Alan Yun clearly is a better speaker designer than businessman! It's a shame, too. The Silverlines I've heard were truly remarkable speakers.

Merlin VSM would fit,good luck,Bob

I suggest the Revel F52. A used pair would be well within your price range. My pair replaced a pair of 2.4's. In my room, with my equipment, the Revel was just as transparent as the Thiel but did not highlight problems in recordings nearly as much. The Thiel had a slightly better soundstage, but the tonal balance of the Revel, along with better bass slam, won the day.