Naim?

you are absolutely correct. for $35k you can get a helluva system that will be much better than just single miserable amp for what name it uses whatever whenever.

science is good, but math is much better

Audiogon peeps need to fix this double posting when creating a post. I made sure I only got the damn button once. It’s been about a week now. Not tryin to be a d..k just saying😃. 

A $35K amp can definitely be worth it… I guess mine was $22K and well worth it. The only way to find out is to read professional reviews and to listen to it… with components you understand.

Having said that, Naim has never appealed to me. To me it strips them music out of the sound.. at least did a number years ago. But house sounds don’t generally change over time. Also, a rule of mine, proven repeatedly over fifty years is heavier is better. So I am suspicious. Any amp I buy will weigh over 100 pounds… preferably a lot more.

Oh I’m sure there are 35k amps that are worth it for some people. I’m just saying just seeing the specs and such of the Naim products I don’t see the value and am curious. Sounds like dalims4 was not too impressed. Ive seen a lot of pricey amps but they weigh 100 lbs plus and look like jewelry. 
 

supernait 3 for example. It’s 80 watts. They say well it’s like no other 80 watts you ever heard blah blah. Even talk about they don’t like the 1% resistors they like the 5% but say they match them in house.
Well it’s still 80 watts and it’s a 24lb integrated. Maybe it’s absolutely fanFingtastic? I don’t know but it’s intriguing to me. 

What’s in the rest of your system ? i have three NAIM components, 2X Unitiserve both w affordable and excellent Pardo LPS. Back in the day you would be hard pressed to buy a better sounding server, it has since been displaced ..but not for less money. I also have the Uniti Atom which includes preamp /streamer / 40 wpc LiL mulekicker of a power amp. A great all in one sans phono preamp. Atom is about $3,500. I have heard the higher end seperates and frankly don’t see value unless you are a NAIM fanatic including the old skool speakers. My liquid cooled made in USA monoblocks are a mere $208 per pound…..

Jim

Damned double posts…

I listened to one a few months ago powering some 27 k$ focals.
It sounded good,

A week later I head some 3-4 k$ speakers powered by a SOTA class-D ~2k$ amp and it sounded about the same.

I suppose it is, “A rose by any other Naim”.

They are pretty popular in the UK I believe. And I am not really a Linn fan or UK sound fan.

In the past I have tried Naim Unitiqute, Naim Uniti Atom, and two years ago I bought a Naim Supernait 3 (all were bought used). The whole PRAT thing never did a thing for me. In all cases, the amps did not last more than a few months in my system. At least in my system, the sound lacked 'body'. Midrange was kinda thin sounding compared to other amps I have owned. 

At these high prices you are just paying for audio jewelry! I'd rather have four Levinson ML2 monoblocs bridged for 100wpc Class A at the old list price of $2K a monobloc! Weight of four - a mere 400+ lbs!

By the way the ML2 25 watt monobloc was designed by the late Tom Colangelo back in 1976. It was Class A with 1 Farad of supply capacitance and weighed over 100 lbs. 100 watts at 2 ohms. Mark Levinson just put his name on electronics designed by others!

I haven't heard Naim separates but I own Uniti Atom ($2300 used) and Uniti Star ($3600 used) and both are great products. Small size unit with lots of punch and control over speakers. I considered and listened to NAD and Cambridge models but Naim to me offered more clarity and overall better sound. For an integrated with great interface for digital, I would highly recommend.

So, that is just for the amp section and it is 25kg which makes it 55lbs and the outboard power supply that comes with it is 35lbs.  Not that weight along is an indication of excellence.  But, note that it ships standard with the power supply in a separate box to ensure the amplifier section is as clean sounding as possible.  

Naim is quite refined in terms of it sound and presentation.  The 500 series is designed to be paired with the Focal Utopia line of speakers and the folks I know who have this amp (I know a few) feel it is fairly priced.  

One other thing to note, it may be 140w into 8 ohms, but this amp is not "stable" at 2 ohms where it can deliver two ohms for a few seconds.  This amp can drive 2 ohm speakers.  There are few amps that can deliver the kind of current that Naim is capable of over extended periods of time.  Match it with the hardest to drive, lowest impedance speakers you can find and this amp with thrive.  

For many, what Naim does is not for them and is not really required.  If you have really hard to drive speakers, Naim should be at the top of the list.  In an extreme example, I had an old pair of Infinity Kappa 8.1s.  I would not buy a $35K amp to pair with 25yo pair of $1700 speakers.  But a Supernait is in-scope.  Those speakers had a min impedance of 1.7 ohms and the Supernait is one of the few integrates that can handle them without constantly blowing fuses.  

Full disclosure.  I am a Naim dealer for the Uniti and Classic lines. I do not have access to the 500s but have heard them on several occasions.  

By the way the ML2 25 watt monobloc was ... It was Class A with 1 Farad of supply capacitance and weighed over 100 lbs. 100 watts at 2 ohms.
​​​​​​…

I suspect that a 1F capacitance would benefit from one of those fancy silver power cords to increase the dynamics? 

we are a naim and focal utopia dealer naim amps are designed to deliver a rich punchy sound that is very engaging,

we have found that a well setup naim system can be prety amazing.

however we have found that a naim system can come alive with a few changes one dont use naim speaker cables.

we had wire world make a set of custom inductors so you can use any speaker cables you want

use aftermarket power cords

use a good power conditioner isotek

Dave and Troy

Audio intellect NJ

naim and focal reference dealer

The good folks at Hawthorne Stereo in Seattle use Naim in their listening room.

I always felt this retailer did things very right. Last month I was in listening to the

KLH Model 5s powered by the Naim? $10k unit. Something gave those speakers

a sound stage wider than I have ever heard-short of a demo of Linkwitz gear

powered five ways.

I wish there was a way for consumers to read stats to see what the real current delivery is in a given amp. Impossible?

I owned and enjoy Naim equipment from about 1990 until 2019. It all sounded very good to me.

I owned the 72 preamp but eventually replaced it with an 82 preamp. Both powered by a hicap.

I went from the little 140 power amp through a couple of 250s and ended up with 135s. I enjoyed the 82/hicap/135 system for many, many years.

Now I've switched to tubes and love the sound of my system. 

I think the comments suggesting that people who have only listened to Naim equipment apply equally to all brands. It is a good idea to broaden our exposure to other technologies, systems, pieces of equipment, engineering, synergy and music.

I like the folks at Hawthorne and they have treated me well. They do a good job representing Naim and have many very satisfied customers. The folks down the street at Definitive Audio also have many satisfied customers.

One criteria that doesn't get mentioned much, but that i think is important, is how long people tend to keep their equipment and be satisfied with it. With respect to that measure, my Naim equipment was very good. I kept it a long time. By comparison I read many posts here and other places where people were always wanting to change something out. They were never satisfied. I, personally, dislike that treadmill.

Best regards,

Markus 

I would really like to find someone local to let me hear maybe a supernait on my system. The brand just has such a following and I want to hear what all the fuss it about. West Mi. Any takers? 

Markus - right on ! In the spring have ya over for a listen, I am in Seattle then.

jim