Cjfrdw
Perhaps you should reread my old posts. I have zero regrets on selling my old SME 30. The only item I ever regret selling would be an Expressive Technologies SU-1. I have had my share of thing through here.
If I had the money to afford both tables I would have them. But "I" would most likely use the TW a lot more. BTW univolving and lifeless are essentially the same words to describe something. I never said the SME could not keep up. It will but to my ears it does not present it like the TW which I prefer more. That is esentially what you will always get when we all heve a difference of opinion. I can state my opinion because I have had both for at least three years. |
Pcosta,
It's always a good thing to hear from people who have had both components in their systems under similar circumstances. As I recall, however, when you sold your SME 30, it was with regret. You implied that you regarded the TW Acustic as sort of an "acceptable downgrade" or at best a side grade that allowed you to free up funds that were tied up in the SME 30 and purchase better electronics.
Your recollections of the SME 30 seem to be increasingly jaundiced with time, what's next, "dull and lifeless"?
Maybe you should at least get an SME 30 into your system again with your upgrades rather than recollect the SME 30 from memory in your previous less upgraded system.
That is why I regard the comments as being unfair. At least draw your comparisons again on equal standing on the same turf.
I have also upgraded my electronics with the SME 30 and have found it to more than keep up, it is a deep and stable vinyl platform. |
It is unfair, to characterize the SME 30 as uninvolving but I am talking from my experiences. These are opinions, and yours may be different from mine but neither should be taken as gospel. It is just a hobby after all. |
Lewm
Yes, it was a dilemma that took a while to resolve. I use active crossover and pass the signal below 80 Hz to a separate pair of subwoofers with SS amplifiers mediated by a tube rectified preamp. The ribbons themselves are motivated by four channels of 50 watt Wavac SET amplifiers MD 572. The small foil supertweeter array is very efficient and is over powered with a 7 watt single ended el 84 amplifier. With the efficiency savings from the active crossover, i estimate the effect is about equivalent to 200 watt per channel SET driving the ribbons. SET's do not have problems with moderately low impednce, they are much more stressed by COMPLEX impedances, they see ribbons as static resistors. |
Dear Cjfrbw, I take your remarks to heart. You make some excellent points. You aroused my curiosity about your own system, so I went to your site. How on earth do you get all those tube amps, particularly flea-power SETs, to drive your 4-ohm ribbon speakers? Sorry for the OT comment. |
Grossly unfair to characterize the SME 30 is "uninvolving". I have some of the most sumptuous, hypnotic playback I have ever heard with my SME 30. Auxiliary electronics, perhaps? I don't like to enter the "brand wars" except in cases of gross misstatement. Most advice tends to be militant, self validating cant from individuals who own the products, anyway. The more militant, the less credible.
The TW may be all that everybody says, I have never heard one, but it seems that it has become popular to bash the SME 30 by comparison as a sour grapes.
The best way to find out, as stated above, is to hear the two either in a similar system or in your own system to determine if the price difference is worth it to a particular individual. |
Elinor
I have the new feet for my TW but I have not tried them yet.
The cool thing about SRA is it is totally cutom for your piece of equipment. So perhaps less of a compromise in comparison to say Symposium or other platforms. Minus K is on another level, but it does have its minor quirks too. Not that elegant either.
I will agree with you on your opinion of the SME tables. They are great at presenting all the info but over time they are a little uninvolving, at least with the SME V, they are a little better with the Graham Phantom. A friend has his with the Phantom. |
Pcosta,
Just as a footnote here, Jeff Catalano is a dealer for SRA and it is what he uses in his set-up with the TW TTs. I don't own an SRA platform. I have an Adona stand and my TW AC-1 is very happy there. I have had many audiophiles at my place and they really like the transparency, quiet backgrounds, soundstage dimensionality, and superb dynamics I get with my set-up. TW now offers its own feet with all new tables. Mine has Stillpoints.
I have heard both the SME 30/2 and the 20/2 TTs at many shows over the last 13 years. In spite of their rep and considerable build quality, I have always found them uninvolving. Of course, this is an opinion based on brief show experience and the usual show conditions. My opinion could be incorrect. |
Peter
The Minus K just cleans things up and makes it even more quiet. It was helpful in my house because my room faces the street which is a high traffic area, also it is an upper floor. I had no problem with foot falls, but anything can help. It is really noticable if I would take the Minus-K out of the set up and run the TW without it.
When I had my SME I used a Silent Running Audio Ohio Class under the SME so it had some more isolation than just a bare SME. You would be very surprised how much better the SME got with the SRA. A lot of people under estimate the value of good isolation even if the unit has a good built in isolation.
I made my comparison with the SME/SRA and a naked TW, and thought it was better for me.
You will really notice a difference with a Minus-K under your SME. It should be fairly cost effective for you too because the smaller units are much more affordable.
Paul |
Pcosta,
I'm intrigued by your comments. How did the addition of the Minus-K platform change the sound of the Raven? I would think that the Raven before the isolation platform sounded very different from the SME 30 with its effective suspension and that with the Minus-K both tables have good isolation and would be fairly similar. Perhaps the difference is more with the cartridge/arm combinations you have/had. The one-motor Raven is certainly less expensive.
I have an SME 10 and am strongly considering placing it on a Minus-K. Thanks.
Peter |
Stiltskin
i am sorry . If you did not understand me , I mean, what he opinion Albert between SME and RAVEN .
And you what is your opinion of them and you have tw raven .
thanks all |
Syaak,
You mention Albert Porter asking where is he.
***This my plan Albert Porter Are you There***
If you know of Albert my question to you is what did Albert replace his Walker Black Diamond with and why? |
Syaak, several reliable sources have expressed that the single motor TW sounds better than the 3 motor version, and it's a lot less money to boot. But at this level I wouldn't think of purchasing without a personal audition, in your system if possible, and there are others which you may find outperform them and the tonearms mentioned. |
I had a SME 20 for two years then the SME 30 for at least three years, I now own a TW AC-1 which I have had since 2006.
TW is as quiet, if not better at making the vinyl sound quiet and clean.
It beats the SME 30 in pitch stability and drive even with the single motor. It sounds as big, with great powerful bass. Clean treble and great mids. The TW is very nice with the Phantom. I only used the SME with the SME V and the Tri-Planar briefly.
TW has a very good distributor in the US in Jeff at High Water Sound. Also Thomas is very generous with his time if you have any technical questions.
Feel free to contact me via email if you want any more opinions on the two tables.
Paul
|
Thanks Nolitan .
Phantom B-44 MKII arm , and A cartridge can be a Dynavector XV1s This my plan Albert Porter Are You There . |
wow,both are awesome tables having heard both at different systems.
either way you cant go wrong but i'll probably inch myself to the raven ac3. Add a Phantom II arm or Grandeza Da Vinci 12" and be all set. |
