Vinyl manufacturers don't stand behind product?

My post directly above is referring to Music Millenium in the first paragraph. The post above it is regarding Everyday Music.

Sorry for the confusion. I thought the "subject" could be changed to become the first sentence...

Rmacdo

I've actually returned 2 defective copies of Neil Young's latest to their shop on 23rd. They were perfectly cool about it, and gave me an exchange for something different. Music Direct mail order will also take back defectives, no problem.

Jackpot took back a Linda Thompson album that has known defects, but I'm sure they would have taken it back anyway. Basically, a shop shouldn't sell a product that they aren't willing to stand behind. There is absolutely no excuse for copping out and putting the responsibility on the manufacturer or distributor.

All I know is that, for vinyl quality, I actually expect the worst these days with new records. If I'm unwrapping it, I expect a clean record with no warps, pops, or ticks. Unfortunately, this is rare. I have better luck with used!

Rmacdo

I've stopped shopping there because I've had trouble returning defects and mis-marked condition albums. They've got a great selection of basics, but they couldn't care less about keeping customers.

Try Jackpot, 2nd Avenue, or Recordsbymail.com (you can pick up there). You'll have much better luck, and they actually seem to appreciate their customers...

Rmacdo

I just gotta say that a lot of this talk makes me DOUBLY appreciative of my dealer and his distributor, by extension. I am also wondering if this situation varies at least by geographic location or individual distributor. I went and bought several LP's yesterday and pointedly asked my guy his scoop. He said that it is about a break-even propostition for him to take a defective LP back, sometimes losing a buck or two. He does not hesitate at all for good customers becasue he wants to keep them as good customers. He went on the say that HIS distributor does an even credit exchange and DOES stand behind defectives, for which he can subsequently seek credit from all but a very few foreign manufacturers.

He went on to say that if a distributor would NOT stand behind product, within reason of course, he would not last long in the business because LP buyers would not stand for such practices. He did comment, however, that he knew things were different with some distributors "back east", but would not further elaborate. Seems this may, in part, be a "what the market will bear" issue.

I don't think its the manufacturers, guys, but the distributors. The local vinyl dealer and I are very good friends and he has told me that absolutely, positively, the vinyl distributors do not take anything back under any circumstances. In fact, everytime he places an order he has to verbally acknowledge over the phone that he understands the "no returns on vinyl" policy. There is also a written clause on whatever form or P.O. that he has to sign, too.

With that said, this retailer WILL take back vinyl for any reason except for "surface noise". Pops, scratches, warps, etc he will take it back no problem. I agree with him that "surface noise" can be a matter of opinion and it is a risk we take by listening to vinyl. He won't allow some knucklehead to rip open 6 copies just to find the best pressing.

Bear in mind that retailers like this guy eat the entire cost of the LP when it is returned. He either marks it way down and tries to sell it as damaged or (I think) he simply adds it to his own collection and tries to listen past the imperfections.

My experience earlier last week was wonderful! I purchased a 180 gm audiophile double album and there were roughly 10 seconds of ear splitting pops on one side. I contacted Red Trumpet, where I purchased it, and received an email back form the President, Richard Flynn. He apologized for the inconvenience, indicated that there hadn't been similar problems with these albums (a response to a question I had asked), and said he was sending another one out to me immediately and to not bother sending back the defective ones.

I'm not implying that he would do this every time for me or with every customer's request to return, but that's service and I appreciate it!

I'd have to suggest to Mitchchavis that he might consider doing his record buying business elsewhere.

To my knowledge and experince, that is total hogwash.

4yanx,
One was Anthony Braxton's "This Time.." by Get Back, manufactured by Abraxas. The other was Otis Redding's "Dictionary of Soul" by Sundazed manufactured by Atlantic under license by Rhino. The retailer didn't look at the manufacturer and indicated all manufacturers have the same "no exchange" policy.

Which mfg.?

Marty,
Everyday Music in Hillsboro refused to take the return back. I confirmed with their West Side store that the manufacturers had a policy of not accepting returned defective product. I plan on going in next week to talk to their manager but still it seems very poor policy for the manufacturer to not replace defective product.

Records, or anything else one buys are covered by an "implied warranty of merchantibility." This can be upheld in any small claims court. Basically a product has got to work as reasonably expected. I'm no lawyer, but I used this approach to get HP to buy back, my Windows ME operating system, so a record ought to be easy.

My surprise was really that the manufacturer would not replace a defective product. I think it's good business for the retailer to take care of a problem with a defective product but I don't think the retailer should be placed in the position of compensating for the manufacturer's careless quality control. I find it surprising that a company would refuse to stand behind the product it brings to market.

Some guys here are always wise-achers when it comes to vinyl, huh? How about the majority of CD's you can buy that are not defective in any way but just sound like crap? :-)

I rarely get a defective LP, but the dealers around where I live will ALWAYS at least exchange for an identical copy or give a store credit. I found that two of five Classic Records Lp's had a BUNCH of surface noise. Dealer took them back before we agreed it best I stop BUYING them - and he agreed it was time he stopped CARRYING them.

There is even a store near me that will give full credit on defective USED LP's. Even LP's that are only a buck. Keeps me coming back.

Mitchdavis, I TOTALLY disagree with Liz on this one. While it may be easier said than done, if your dealer won't honor a defective LP, time to find another dealer. Tell this guy it has been ten years since the dealer you USED to patronize refused to stand behind his product. You're not lucky he carries vinyl, he's lucky you come in his store to buy it.

I find very few defectives, but I've never had a dealer refuse to replace one. That includes 5 or 6 different mail order dealers, and Classic Records is also particularly good about returns.

No, Pbb, I'm not saying they are all perfect. I am saying I haven't gotten any defective ones in a long time, so I do not know if there has been a change in the return policy.

I bought a new copy of Tom Petty (the last DJ) from Toys From The Attic and I was amazed at the terrible comdition it was in.
It was dirty for one.Had a severe warp and surface noise like you wouldnt believe.
TFTA gave me full credit.I bought 2 Bob Dylan Sundaze monos with the credit.
The Sundaze monos are very nice LP's!!
Where's the quality control with some of these re-issues?
Floyd's vinyl re-issue of DSOTM is hit or miss from what I've read also.

The retailer is pretty big here in the Portland,OR area but it's worth a try. I'll see what the manager says(I was told he won't be in until Tuesday). I did call another of their downtown stores and the info was confirmed by that store. It's a shame the manufacturers leave it up to the retailer to handle their quality problems. I'm curious if this is a standard now or if some manufacturers do take back their defective vinyl.

I just bought a copy of Dark Side of the Moon for my brother-in-law. When he unwrapped it there was the residue of a sticker including glue and paper on the LP. The VPI 17 would not remove any of it. I brought it back without the receipt and the person gave me credit for the LP and ordered three more copies. When they came in I bought all three of them.
My expereince was pleasant and I will continue to buy from this local dealer.
I buy lots of LPs on the internet but not from AudiogoN where the prices are out of line!!! Whenever possible I buy from the local shops, but sometimes they don't have what I want, then I go to the web. Not the other way around since I had worse on-line expereinces than I have had locally.
The dealer you mentioned should offer a full refund and get another copy for you. He is lying, I bet...

Vinyl record making must have died and gone to Heaven, because when it was all that was around returning poor pressings (you name the defect they had them)was a regular occurrence. Now TWL are you saying that they are all perfect? My oh my!

A shop near me told me the same thing, the distributors won't take it back. I guess it is up to the retailer whether they want to eat the return.

I checked Music Direct's web site and they exchange defective LPs. Probably a bigger operation than your local retailer but your local guy may wish to reconsider if you suggested taking your business elsewhere.

I've never heard of anything like that. I think the dealer was pulling your leg. However, I can truthfully say that I haven't had to return any records in the last 10 years, since I haven't had any bad ones in at least that long. I really believe that the manufacturer will give a replacement if it is truly defective. But a retailer may not want to be bothered with dealing with it. Just my 2 cents.