Synergistic calls out Audioholics

@prof
Putting aside that rather rash conclusion...

This is not a rash conclusion. The article logically shows that the currently known methods cannot determine ALL the characteristics of sound in the way that a person perceives it, and most importantly - this will never be possible as long as audio engineers and acoustics are trying to make up music from its parts.

@prof
The typical audiophile gear, cables included, come with a technical story from the manufacturer. "Here’s a technical problem that can undermine the performance of X item; Here’s how we solve that problem." And you are told about "skin effect," "radiation," "electrical interference," "dielectrics" "active shielding" and on and on. In other words, all type of phenomena that we know through being able to detect with instruments and measure. Then they lay out some claim about how they have technically addressed the problem.

If we are talking about wires, then all these explanations are made either out of ignorance of the basics of audio engineering, or specifically for the technocratic majority, so as not to frighten the buyer with "mysticism and other anti-science".

@prof
Well, not everything is measurable you know! Stop looking to measurements!

If you could read Essien's article carefully, you would have understand that there are things in a musical signal that can be measured, and there are things that we can only perceive subjectively. Scientists initially failed to create a correct theory that would explain all the nuances of human perception. Therefore, a qualified amp engineer only measures distortion, Linearity, and power. He does this to make sure that he has a reliable "framework" for everything else that is more important. More important is what we can only determine by ear - the results of manipulations with wires and their directions, various materials, and other tricks familiar to audiophiles. These manipulations significantly affect the perception of music, but they do not affect the technical characteristics to the extent that they become noticeable by ear and it would make sense to measure them

By the way, you came up with the last phrase in a fit of emotion. Personally, I am not against measurements when it comes to power frequency, noise and other technical things. I'm just saying that not everything can be measured. This is the same thing that follows from the Essien article.

@prof
SR for instance talks about how you will hear a significant increase in frequency linearity with one of their cables. That would be measurable, right?

No. When discussing the sound of cables, we can only talk about entangible changes in the sound, here we mean the coloration: “…the accentuation (or darkening) of certain frequency regions of the sound range, which is marked by our perception”.. The distortion of the electrical signal in the cable is so small that no person is able to catch them.

You seem to understand the basics of electricity. I have a counter question - can you calculate how much the signal level in the acoustic cable should be changed so that an ordinary person can hear the difference, if it is known that a person is able to determine the difference in the volume change of at least 1 dB (psychoacoustics data), the output voltage of the amplifier =10 volts, and the speaker resistance =4 ohms?

@prof

Measurements have their place. They are where the journey begins, not where it ends. 
I am not a manufacturer of audio gear, I am a consumer. I have an audience of one. A unique and highly specific audience. Me. 
If I hear something I like, I don’t care what causes it. As I am the beginning, middle, and end of my listening experience, the reason why it works or doesn’t is irrelevant. 
If I were a manufacturer, then those numbers may be of interest to some. 
Curious, two capacitors, different manufacturers with identical measurements will not have the same sonic signature. Two tubes, different manufacturers with the same measurements will not have the same sonic signature. 
It is not difficult to find two uniquely different amplifiers that have the same measurements, and yet sound vastly different. 
Measurements. What measurements? What standards? 
History is full of examples of scientists who theorized a particular reason for a phenomenon. Then they sought to prove their thesis. In the margins of their notes, you can see how they modify their calculus in order to have the equation validate their thesis. 
Measurements and the scientific method. 
I have no problem with measurements. But like I said, they are where the journey begins. And what do the measurements mean sonically in my system?
This hobby is one small part of what I do with my time. More so during the last year as CV19 has shut down my day job. 
Have you ever designed and built a speaker? Listened to how the volume of the enclosure, the size and length of the port, the crossover design, crossover point, damping and stuffing effect the sound? There are all kinds of equations to aide in this process. In the past year, I have built some 2 dozen unique speakers. A purely creative and exploratory process. Doing, and listening. No preconceived notions of what should generate a better result. Just listening. 
A handful of stuffing behind the driver in a 300ltr enclosure, will effect the sound quality. 
There is no measurements that will predict those nuanced effects and if I will like or dislike the sonic effect.

I need to hear it to know if I like it.

Do any of Stereophiles measurements tell you how the gear will sound?

Prof is just using sophistry to further his trolling, having what he thinks is fun. He’s never been successful at it but one has to give him credit for perseverance.

Ever notice how most of his discussions are off in the weeds and straw man arguments, which he accuses others of? Then he gets way too semantical and turns phrases and wordings on their heads.

Must have been a hot shot back on the debating team.

All the best,
Nonoise

Some people think that intelligence can be measured... There is some correlation yes between some measuring test and some aspect of intelligence but we CANNOT measure intelligence...It is the same thing in psychoacoustic...But simple mind cannot even fathom the essential questions in psychoacoustic they think that all is solved and exposed in a book or 2 about some aspect of engineering....

Then why not cables effects, and all audible experience...All reduced to measures...

A.I. tomorrow will give them some kind of "proof"...

What i just said is anyway false, tomorrow is already today for the technocratic cult....The idolatry of technology is the opposite of science...

I am retired and i speak too much here ......But i like to partake my audio experience....

04-15-2021 3:09pmOh yeah children choking to death because their parents are dumber than rocks is freaking hilarious. I heard a comedian on the radio....
Guess the state is required to keep kids safe from their idiotic parents.  Especially from those dangerous chocolate eggs. Assault rifles are AOK however. 
Parents who don’t/can’t monitor properly. Easier to have children than it is to get a drivers license. And we all see how great drivers are...