Moving into an apartment with wood joist floors - worried about neighbors hearing


Hey all,

So during the pandemic I bought a pair of very Manhattan-unfriendly Egglestonworks Kivas. They sound amazing! 

However I recently decided to move and found an amazing old loft. While signing the lease I saw a bunch of language about noise and playing music loud - and now I’m starting to wonder if I’ve made a huge mistake.

I’ve lived in places with concrete floors the last 15 years, so i didn’t even think about it when taking the place, but this old building has wood joist floors. 

While I don’t listen loud - I’ve always been a low- to medium-volume listener - I’m worried that even then the Kiva’s will have too much bass energy.

The opposite pressure is that the room is huge with high ceilings. So in a vacuum, the Kiva’s would be the perfect speaker for the space.

The way I see it I have two options:

1) Try to move in with the Kiva’s and do everything I can to contain their energy (bass traps / panels / thick rugs / Isoacoustics Gaia pucks - some of which I already have). If there are complaints, then get different speakers or use equalization to lower the bass on my digital sources (not an option for vinyl though)

Or:

2) Get different speakers proactively. If I do this, I could consider a pair of bookshelf speakers with limited LF (SF Amati’s or those WIlson bookshelves?)

Anyone have any experience with this? If I go route #2, what about planar ribbon speakers like Maggie 3.7? Seems like the dispersion on them might solve a lot of the problem here, but not sure if they’ll still resonate the floor.

hudsonhawk

There are two different problems:  1) mechanical vibrations of the speakers being transferred to the floor, and 2) sound waves from the speakers hitting the floor, causing it to vibrate and produce sound.  The first problem can be pretty much solved with mechanical isolation, as described in this video:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmZKKVQZx_Y

The second problem can be greatly mitigated by placing material under the speaker that absorbs low frequencies.  The guy at Acoustic Fields seems to know what he's talking about and claims carbon is the best (practical) material for absorbing low frequencies.  He sells various carbon based absorbers, including platforms.  The drawbacks are expense and an increase in speaker height.  He has some DIY guides too.

Several things come to mind here:

Very good tips on sound isolation/absorption.  Keep in mind that powerful low frequency sound waves are very long and can penetrate feet (yes, FEET) of sound absorption.  But,every bit helps.

If you love your Kivas, rolling off the bass via tone controls/EQ will accomplish the same goals as a bookshelf speaker in bass reduction without changing speakers.  Yes, you will not get the performance you paid for, but you'll get 90+ percent of it.

Using a meter to measure sound in your neighbor's space may get you technically, and legally(?) there, but sound pollution is a 'thing" and it's not cool.  Your neighbors have made an investment in their spaces and desire a living environment that is theirs -- not yours. A rule of thumb: if your neighbors can hear your system, it's too loud.  Sorry to be heavy-handed here, but I have first-hand experience with this on the "receiving" end.  Simple reading, polite conversation, and enjoying one's own personal music is compromised. 

This a bit of a tangent, on neighbor relations, and sappy but I’ma tell it anyway. When I bought my current place 25 years ago my neighbor marched right over , 1st day, extended his hand and introduced himself. He was retired and proly in his 70’s. My house was a bit of a fixer upper and the grass was hammered due to derelict sprinkler system. Neighbor’s lawn was well kept. After he saw me working on the sprinkler and the rest of the house, he came over and offered to help. Both front and back control valve manifolds were trashed. While I was at work he went to a pipe fitter and had copper manifold sweated up and installed them, never ask for dime. That forged the foundation of a friendship with a family that lasted until his passing. Since then I have repaired heads, lines and valves over the years but I have never had to touch that copper manifold and we get zub zero here in the Rockies. So every late fall when I winterize the system and I look at that manifold all incrusted with grime and dirt , I think of him.

I like the idea of using an equalizer, when necessary, to roll off bass.  You can use it during listening sessions during the evening, particularly at late hours, and use less or no equalization at other time, on weekends, etc.  It is a nice adaptive solution that will allow you to go wild on Saturday afternoons yet reduce noise transmission at other times.  In any case, rug and pad covering of the largest amount of floor possible will help a lot, as will any coverage of the walls with damping.  

The ultimate solution, one that will generally involve ownership of the space, involves companies that do isolation professionally--they can use springs and dampers to float a floor above the original floor, they can add additional noise damping sheetrock to existing walls (isolated from the existing wall by damping material such as "Green Glue" adhesive), and even treat the ceiling.

There is some solid advise given, and some a bit drastic or too much too soon.
I had a loft studio space in an old textile building in MA years ago, so I have some experience. Keep your speakers, do all the normal furnishings you are thinking: rugs, plants, things to break up the directed sound waves, and a couple ACTUAL bass traps to start.  Like other mentioned, go introduce yourself to your neighbors, take some cookies or something from a great local place.  DO NOT MENTION YOUR SPEAKERS AT FIRST VISIT.  I had issues with one neighbor that I realized all started because I began my introductions with them by saying "let me know if you can hear my system": within a week, I was getting constant calls and door bangs for just the TV being on LOW volume in the background.  SO -say hi, maybe see how they have their spaces set up, maybe one of them has a great sound system too!  You can likely tell their personalities and possible issues from that first visit.

In my current home (1920 old dimensional wood floors, very close neighbors) I actually measured and found the best spot for my sub-woofer (now using great larger bookshelf speakers, not floor standers): I used a web site that will calculate what each speakers pressure is and best placement spots, as well as dead or excited points in your space.  The bookshelfs are on awesome custom narrow box tube stands with slate slabs on top of the stand, under the speaker, and they are placed on top of the floor joists (spikes). Then I put the subwoofer on a slate stone hunk as well with cut in half racket balls under the slab, also carefully placed on top of floor joist but a bit further from a wall barrier than usual.  The outcome was compromising some on extension/depth output, but things are much more articulate and accurate, and the sound doesn't extend into the basement or beyond the walls like when I first moved in.  

Townsend platforms I bet would be the best bang for your buck, then the traps and all.  I really hope you can keep the speakers.  Would love to see how your space turns out!