A DAC that ought to be better known: RME

Thanks for the info. I have been using the RME with a VTV Purifi Eval amp and have been delighted to this up update will be good. 

FYI for all RME adi 2 FS and Pro owners.   RME recently released new firmware 35/35 for the DAC.   It supposedly lowers jitter on SPDIF coax and OPT inputs,  more accurate meter response and easier preset loading.   

Update was super easy via USB....took about 30 seconds. Reboot and the firmware version 35 will appear at startup on the RME display .  

Nothing better than free enhancements after you buy something.   

rtotchia

I run my RME balanced out and others with a balanced preamp or amp should do the same, if their other components are truly a balanced design. You should notice a lower noise floor. When you compare the two cables, try doing it at a fairly low listening level getting the the level matched the best you can. I find running balanced I can listen at lower levels and it’s still as enjoyable. You really need two of the same cable to do a fair comparison, but I have had great results with even Canare balanced IC’s.

paul

when you get the tube adapters from garage1217 please note one important thing... the pins on the adapters are LONG... too long... you should insert the tube into the adapter first, then carefully insert the adapter into the mhdt tube socket only about 1/2 in, not much more... if you insert the adapter pins in all the way there is a chance that you can break a solder connection below, and then, once the adapter is removed there will be a lost connection on one of the tube socket pin solder joints to the pcb underneath...

For the first time ever I started using XLR balanced cables and put them on the RME, replacing my usual RCAs. A professional audio fellow told me always to get used to a given cable and then change them over one by one to notice the difference better. I know this is a touchy subject but I believe I can hear a difference. So I am very inclined to the PS upgrade after a while.

Mofojo, I did compare the Pardo vs stock after a few months of break in. Pardo expands soundstage, improved spl in the room, midrange became much more natural and put nice weight and body on the highs, it just made everything more musical, bigger and smoothed things out but your mileage may vary.

jjss49, I'm going to order the adapters just haven't got around to it. I have a lot of 6sn7's, ken rads, RCA gray glass and so on plus amprex, bugle boy,SQ's, valvo and many other 6922. I very interested where that would take the MHDT, thanks for the suggestion.

@paulcreed 
It's not clear to me from your post if you thought the Teddy made a difference? 

@paulcreed

go to garage1217 get 6sn7 and 6dj8 to 5670 tube converters they sell, then start tube rolling

it opens a whole new world of what the mhdt can do from its stock ge mini tube ... dunno the rest of your system but you should hear wonderful new presentations of the sound/music

have fun!

If you check out headfi forum they have an on going forum on the RME and most do not believe an upgraded lps will help. They say "RME doesn't recommend it" So I guess everyone believes different. I bought the RME and waited about 2 weeks for Teddy Pardo. Breaking it in with stock power supply I thought sound stage lacked and it was treble forward but that could have been break in. jjss49 I know what you mean by "zippy" no offense taken and RME was 2 dimensional and treble forward with no meat on the bones and most of all not engaging. Before the RME I tried the Qutest but it wasn't for me. I was looking to move on and sell RME. After about 6 or 7 weeks It became big and warm 3 dimensional with very inviting midrange and very smooth non fatiguing crystal clear highs. Crystal clear very transparent highs is something the MHDT can't do as well in my system. As good as RME soundstage became MHDT stage is a little better or different not night and day but very noticeable. I do find the RME responds very well to footers. I have the MHDT stock feet sitting on top of a preamp power supply with a fairly cheap USB and XLO signature output cables so it may be an unfair comparison while RME sits on Nordost footers under the maple and golden sound jumbos footers under the RME . I do find the MHDT can fall apart on fast complex fusion, jazz or busy music but can be more engaging than the RME at times certainly with small acoustic jazz which is very important to me. I think these dacs are very system dependent, what sound good to me sounds bad to others. Honestly I wouldn't want to be without one or the other depending on the mood I'm in. Sometimes I will listen to the RME for a week or so and then the MHDT for a week or 2 or switch between the 2 in the same night. I need to get the MHDT a better input cable and platform to see what happens, both the RME and MHDT source is Auralic g1. 

I’ll check my spam folder to see maybe I missed a response from them. 

When I ordered my Teddy Pardo it took 2-3 weeks at best to make it to my doorsteps. When I first emailed them inquiring on their product I had a response the next morning, which being across the globe and different time zones I felt response was quick enough. Emailed a couple times before making an order online and they always responded timely. Very respectful company that made their name with Naim users. Well made and nice case... not Jeff Rowland but not cheap either.

Let us know how it works.  

I contacted small green computer and they responded in minutes. Reccomended the 25w variable V power supply. 

Teddy Pardo responded to me quickly. I have heard that Small Green Computer is a good, innovative company but have no personal experience. 

I see another on from Small Green Computer that is about half the price of the Teddy and the Sbooster. Anyone know anything about this guy? 
I would feel better about ordering within the US than something out of Israel just from a shipping and returns standpoint. Also emailed Teddy with some questions and no response. That being said if it’s better I may consider. 

Teddy Pardo are made and sold direct out of Israel so I doubt with shipping they would do a return but the sBooster may be one from Upscale Audio that does. Can’t speak for the others but I’m sure they are close in performance. I chose the Teddy based on positive comments from actual users and I prefer the appearance of it over the sBooster. I’m considering a Teddy for both my ProJect Xtension 10 table and Parks Audio Budgie phono preamp. Probably start with the Budgie as I really question on a turntable motor it will make a difference but ProJect recently came out with a linear supply as an upgrade for my table so who knows?

Before I upgraded to the Teddy I was using a custom power cord I made to go to the switch supply from the wall and that made an improvement, which convinced me if a power cord on the stock switch supply can make an improvement then surely a different supply would do as well and it did. I would suggest trying a power cord first to see if you hear a difference. The cord I made is the same one I also built for my Bluesound Vault 2 which also made an improvement with its internal switched PS. There’s been many discussions on the Bluesound players on upgrading the C7 type power cord so you can find several recommendations by others there under Bluesound Node and Vault players. Another nice thing about adding a linear supply is most have the more typical IEC inlet for more common cords.

i think some of the good lps makers do offer a money back trial -- that makes the venture an easier one...

Adg101 I am going to take your advice on the settings. It’s very confusing about the power upgrade because one gets diverging opinions. But if you all hear a difference it’s difficult to argue with you. I see a Pardo in my future.

@rtorchia

One of the arguments for upgrading, if that is indeed the right word, is that the fancy PSs are more robust. In the end I think upgrading a PS is like exotic cables--something that can be endlessly debated.

i disagree with this statement... power supply upgrades, especially from modern relatively cheap switching power supplies, can be very important to sound quality to both analog and digital gear... switching ps’s are well known to introduce noise into circuits they feed - makers of gear can do internal filtering and isolation and that minimize the damage done, but moving to a well built well filter linear power supply will usually have a positive effect, big or small

and for the record, rob watts @ chord vehemently states that their dacs will not benefit from after market lps units... but i have had 3 chords and they all sound better with one

naim rega modwright lehmann holo well tempered labs are just a few highly respected audio makers of various components from turntables to amps to dacs that offer upgrades for better sound quality through better power supplies

rtotchia, I suggest you try a different PS as you really have no claim to disqualify mine or others that have thrown out the stock switched supplies that come with the RME, Chord and others. You can call us nuts and it will be your loss, not mine. RME does state they do not believe changing the PS will make a difference, and Nelson Pass of Pass Labs for years suggested in his nicely written manuals that changing power cords will not benefit the sound of his amps, but guess what? He’s now acknowledging they do. I own a Pass amp and I didn’t need Mr. Pass to tell me either or. I suspect Pass Labs and maybe RME are saying, or said what they did to claim their gear is so good there’s nothing to improve it... great marketing I think.

I run my RME flat, all settings locked with the sharp filter set and it doesn’t need any tweaking of the EQ, loudness or whatever you want to adjust in my system and I am running it direct to my amp. I think it’s great they offer all the flexibility on the ADI, but I prefer to take the more pure approach and change out the power supply which is what distinguishes quality gear over not so good is the power supply. Hopefully you get the chance or the urge to try a linear supply as I think you’ll be surprised, but it does require a revealing system and ears to hear the differences which hopefully you have both.

The stock RME does sound really good on its own but it does lack some weight and the stage is a little closed in. As mentioned by others, it can be a little forward sounding. I’m not sure any setting within the RME is going to adjust that but maybe you’ll get lucky. If you love the way it sounds out of the box, then that’s all that really matters in the end. Glad you are enjoying your RME.

For the record RME doesn't recommend upgrading the PS. There are many ways to adjust the sound of the RME if you study the manual very carefully. In that respect it is a very professional device. On the Exogal and various other more commercial DAC products aimed at the audiophile market I had no way to adjust anything. The RME PS is notorious for having a finicky locking mechanism but once you secure it all is fine. One of the arguments for upgrading, if that is indeed the right word, is that the fancy PSs are more robust. In the end I think upgrading a PS is like exotic cables--something that can be endlessly debated. 

Teddy Pardo
12V/2A with 2.1mm connector. The connector is not a locking type as with the stock switch PS, but it is a snug fit so no concern it will pull out over any other plug.

Just added a Synergistic Research Orange fuse and too soon to tell. Want to give it some time to cook in but first impression is very positive. I have Blacks in my preamp and CDP and know there, they made an improvement. Quick opinion is in the Teddy, things seem more natural and the top end is still very clean but maybe a tad smoother. Sounds damn good, so excited to let it settle in.

I also have both my RME and Teddy on two separate 1 1/2”thick Baltic Birch platforms I built sitting on three isolation pads.

I’m still running the RME direct to amp. Sounds incredible. I also leave mine on 24/7. Not in any hurry to throw my ModWright preamp back in until I spin vinyl.

The biggest thing I feel the Teddy does, is improves the stage on the RME in depth especially. The top end cleans up but it does set it back and not at all forward. Additionally the bottom end really digs deeper and mid bass, midrange is fuller. I didn’t find the stock RME bright or fatiguing but now comparing back to stock I will never go back. The transformation is significant with the Teddy. I’m probably using cables that are a little overkill, but maybe not as they pull out what the RME/Teddy combo is capable of. 

@paulcreed

maybe my use of the word ’zippy’ is getting us hung up a bit... i found the voicing of the rme to be somewhat treble forward and i would not call the midrange or bass warm... neutral and fast i would say, but not bloomy or warm in the least to my ears (there are significantly warmer-voiced dacs - metrums, ayre codex, mhdt’s in stock form, esp. with the we 2c51 tube come to mind)

i currently have a number of mhdt units (orchid, stockholm, istanbul), the stockholm i have is modded with pcm56k chip, vishays diodes and mundorf silver oil caps, other two are stock... i do find the modded stockholm to have the most highlighted treble and the best drive of the 3 mhdts, so i am not surprised your modded mhdt plays slightly brighter than the stock units - of course, the mhdt units’ sound can be further shaped with choice of tube, options are plentiful and the range of ’adjustment’ is fairly substantial

to me, i don’t fault the tonality of the rme... voicing is a matter of taste, and many systems and listeners like more ’effortless’ detail that a forward treble voicing affords -- my personal feeling is that the weakness of the rme is its relatively flat and narrow imaging... tonally i find chord dacs similarly detail oriented but their imaging is vastly superior, wider deeper bigger stage, simply more holographic, leaving aside tonal balance - the mhdt’s really excel at imaging and dimensionality...

this being said, i had the rme for about 6 months (before selling it to a good friend who is a headphone listener, for which i think the unit is really ideal), and i did not use an upgraded ps with it, so maybe i have not heard it at its best -- then again, i was using the chord qutest at the time with its own factory supplied switching ps as well...

adg101, paulcreed:
Which model Teddy Pardo did you use with RME?

Paul,

don’t keep us hanging brother. Comparison!!! Appreciated. 

jjss49, I don't find RME "zippy" in my room. I also have a highly modded MHDT Labs dac to compare it with and the RME is far from zippy when played side by side in the same system. I do have the Teddy Pardo on the RME with JPS Labs digital cable and Acoustic Zen silver ref 2 going out to preamp. You would think the silver wire would make it zippy but that's not the case. I find RME is very transparent and warm but in no way "zippy". I did find it took over a month to break in, I leave Teddy Pardo and RME on 24/7 and notice even being on 24/7 it take 20 or so minutes of music running through it before it sounds right. 

Thanks for the suggestions. I do run it directly into the amp. Will definitely get the power supply after a while. 

Add a linear external power supply and throw the switch one away. Something such as the Teddy Pardo will step it up to another level. No zippy sound whatsoever. Teddy delivered will run you $400 and worth every penny.

the rme is an excellent unit, tons of useful features and very good sound, especially for headphone users

very hard to beat for the $, for those who want a clear, upfront, somewhat 'zippy' sound

but in my experience there are better sounding ones for more somewhat more $

Soekris Discrete R2R Dac’s use them direct into poweramps with their own digital domain volume control .
Their best ones will compete with the top Holo, Denafrips and many of the MSB’s
http://www.soekris.dk/

Cheers George

Great DAC for sure.... I bought one last year and love it .  

If you do a little digging the RME is pretty well known as a standout at its price point and somewhat above. Gets mention quite often. I’ve had mine a few months. Very impressed with it!

 Not sure how you are using it but I would highly recommend trying going direct into power amp with it.