They are all wonderful but I prefer Vinyl for sure.
Classical music listening... what is a better source High Rez or Vinyl?
For many of us who really enjoy classical music, for me it is Baroque and opera, what is the better and more consistent for source high fidelity listening?
I am a mid hifi guy and have a Pro-ject Classic SB turntable with a high output MC Sumiko Blue Point No. 2 cartridge.. I am using a Jolida JD 9II Tube phone stage, with a vintage Telefunkin tube upgrade.
I have a Rogue Sphinx 3 integrated amplifier, with a vintage Mozada tube upgrade. My digital source DAC/SACD/CD is a Yamaha CD-2100 player.
I have refurbished Ohm H's loud speakers.
I have been picking up many vintage classical albums recently, mainly 1980’s releases in excellent condition too, at my local transfer station, and it has been mixed bag in comparison to my high resolution music files and SACD collection.
I was expecting much more when it came to vinyl and classical but I have not been as won over, as I have been with rock and jazz on vinyl.
My experience with SACD and high resolution, 96/24 or higher, has been very rewarding with a wide variety of classical music. Opera really shines in digital IMHO. Strong and full on classical piece are quite stunning on many a SACD releases I own. Rachel Podger’s Vivaldi: L’estro armonico - 12 concerti, Op. 3 on SACD is an excellent example of the audio quality I demand, as this recording is exceptional! Plus there are are very few new remastered vinyl releases for classical, particularly for opera, these days. A perfect example of this is Shubert’s Winterreise featuring Joyce DiDanato and pianist Yannick Nezet-Sequin, which I saw performed at Carnegie Hall for this recording and which sounds phenomenal in 96/24, and was release recently.
That would seem counter intuitive but that is clearly what the market is showing.
On one of these threads I recall someone posting how strings of violins, and the intensity that they are played at, can lead to degraded sound quality depending on the type of cartridge used.
I want to hear back from the classical music posse here to help me get to that higher level of listening with classical vinyl.
Is it the cartridge?
Or should I just stay with my digital sources?
I am a mid hifi guy and have a Pro-ject Classic SB turntable with a high output MC Sumiko Blue Point No. 2 cartridge.. I am using a Jolida JD 9II Tube phone stage, with a vintage Telefunkin tube upgrade.
I have a Rogue Sphinx 3 integrated amplifier, with a vintage Mozada tube upgrade. My digital source DAC/SACD/CD is a Yamaha CD-2100 player.
I have refurbished Ohm H's loud speakers.
I have been picking up many vintage classical albums recently, mainly 1980’s releases in excellent condition too, at my local transfer station, and it has been mixed bag in comparison to my high resolution music files and SACD collection.
I was expecting much more when it came to vinyl and classical but I have not been as won over, as I have been with rock and jazz on vinyl.
My experience with SACD and high resolution, 96/24 or higher, has been very rewarding with a wide variety of classical music. Opera really shines in digital IMHO. Strong and full on classical piece are quite stunning on many a SACD releases I own. Rachel Podger’s Vivaldi: L’estro armonico - 12 concerti, Op. 3 on SACD is an excellent example of the audio quality I demand, as this recording is exceptional! Plus there are are very few new remastered vinyl releases for classical, particularly for opera, these days. A perfect example of this is Shubert’s Winterreise featuring Joyce DiDanato and pianist Yannick Nezet-Sequin, which I saw performed at Carnegie Hall for this recording and which sounds phenomenal in 96/24, and was release recently.
That would seem counter intuitive but that is clearly what the market is showing.
On one of these threads I recall someone posting how strings of violins, and the intensity that they are played at, can lead to degraded sound quality depending on the type of cartridge used.
I want to hear back from the classical music posse here to help me get to that higher level of listening with classical vinyl.
Is it the cartridge?
Or should I just stay with my digital sources?
65 responses Add your response
I hardly ever listen to my classical vinyl collection; I listen mostly to CDs ripped to a music server (about 3500 classical CDs). As far as sound quality is concerned, the extreme dynamic range of classical music means that soft passages have to be recorded at quite low levels which mean that ticks and pops become more prominent. I also find that mass voices also seem to become muddled when the volume level rises on records. There is also the major annoyance of having to flip records, breaks that might have to be in the middle of a movement (e.g., second movement of Mahler's Symphony No. 8), and difficulty in finding one's place in an opera libretto. The main reason for going digital is that the library of performance is vastly larger. I can find most of the performances I have on records available on a digital format, but, a good 50% of what I have on digital sources were never issued on vinyl. |
| Post removed |
If you want to keep up to any degree with what is happening NOW, you need a good digital source. I absolutely agree! Being a huge fan of contemporary classical music, limiting oneself to vinyl, would eliminate so much incredible music from the last few decades. Thomas Ades, Augusta Read Thomas, Unsuk Chin, Nico Muhly, Erkki-Sven Tuur, Esa Pekka Salonan, James Dillon, Jennifer Hidgon, and many more. Hell, even many composers from the 20th century had a majority of their compositions released only digitally. Elliott Carter, Bruno Maderna, Joan Tower, Toru Takemitsu, etc. I could never imagine giving up such a large part of my music collection, in the name of 'vinyl purity'... |
I am enjoying how this thread is blossoming as well as getting some good recommendations to check out. @frogman @edcyn thanks for the tip on the Decca and London vintage recordings. I only actually got back into vinyl last November and my vinyl classical collection is still in it's infancy, but I did have a mono London FFrr album by Pilar Lorengar from the early 1960's that I saved from my local transfer station. Wow ! I was thoroughly impressed by Ms. Lorengar exquisite voice and the sound stage on the album was quite impressive too. This mono recording was lush and dynamic allowing Ms. Lorengar's captivating soprano voice to dance and soar. I just scored two Joan Sutherland London boxed sets in near mint condition on that famous secondary site for under $30 total. I also picked up a CBS Records Masterworks recording of Yo-Yo Ma from 1983, in mint condition, with harpsichord Kenneth Cooper playing Bach's Sonatas for Viola da Gamab & Harpsichord and other works Yo-Yo' cello playing is full of lustrous and brilliant notes that you can feel in your chest...that is always an indication to me of an exceptional recording. The harpsichord also sounds quite natural and vibrant and not overly tenuous in tone either. Have a good weekend everyone. |
This is a bad question. There are so many factors that go into this. Number one is whether or not the recording engineer(s) got it right in the first place, or if the recording is historic and relying on outdated recording technology, digital or not. Garbage in, garbage out. Then, is the source digital or analog? Is the mastering digital or analog? There was a period of time when there was labeling on the CD or LP that addressed this: AAA ADD DDD DDA So, you can get an LP that was recorded and mastered digitally. That was thought to be good. Some systems - mine, for example - reveal an audible difference between an LP that is DDA and is AAA. On my system, DDA sounds thin and lacking in timber and atmospherics. |
If you are serious about hearing some really good sounding classical: https://better-records.com/search?q=tchaikovsky I have the 1812, only mine is White Hot. Freaking insane. |
Here is an update. I have started seeking out some of the 1960's London recordings. I picked up an excellent copy of " Luci Di Lammermoor" with Dame Joan Sutherland, OSA 1327, and it sounds phenomenal! I also picked up another excellent one of " Norma" again with Sutherland and one of my favorite opera, with Richard Bonynge conducting The London Symphony Orchestra and Chorus Stereo OSA-1394 I also made some slight adjustments with my photo stage too and are very happy with the improved performance and sound stage. I am curious to seek out some vintage 45 rpm. If any one has any recommendations of Operas or Baroque I would appreciate it. |
@idigmusic64 True vintage 45 rpm classical discs have got to be as rare as hen’s teeth. My sense of it is that Thirty-Three-and-a-Third 10" and 12" High-Fi LP discs essentially directly replaced the bulky, low-fi 78 rpm zillion disc classical record albums of the previous era. Yeah, I inherited a few classical 45 rpm singles from my dad. But I’m pretty sure that the idea of putting classical music onto 12" 45’s is an audiophile affectation that only came into existence in the modern era. |
A major reason that some digital listening disappoints those familiar with analog is the very poor analog section even in some of the most expensive DACs. They often compare VERY unfavorably with the "analog section" of a phono pre, which is to say, the phono pre itself. But they are there to do a similar job. A DAC may have a sophisticated digital section providing apparent transparency, space and dynamics to a bunch of instruments that seem themselves to be made of cardboard. And some listeners think these DACs are great--especially after good reviews. Without providing as much in effort to the analog section though, the DAC will miss the harmonic richness and depth of sound we usually attribute to good analog. From the point of the DAC maker, most of his potential customers may have never heard a musical instrument except through a loudspeaker. So some multi-kilobuck DACs use chip op amps costing a buck or two at the center of their analog section. Call me cynical. Replacing chip op amps in DACs of all sorts with good discrete analog sections has become a hobby to some and a profession for others. So, if you're an analog person, as I am, don't tell me of your disappointment with your expensive DAC. Look inside first. Then we can talk. And by the way, while amp and preamp manufacturers are pleased to tell you what's inside their cases, DAC makers often are not. Rather, they often try hard to hide what's inside. As do many of the reviewers. |
@edcyn the proverbial holy grail I guess. It makes sense that it would only be modern releases. I enjoyed your post. @melm great post as well. How can you find out what type of analog chip or amp your DAC currently has? Plus is there a site were these aficionados post their insight? I also have a couple Mercury Living Legend records coming in the mail soon too. |
@idigmusic64 But for very special designs, like batteries for the PS, I would make sure any solid state phono pre I might buy would have a linear power supply and a discrete amplification section. I would look for the same in the analog section of a DAC. As for the analog section, usually if the manufacturer’s description doesn’t make a special point of a discrete section, it won’t have one. But if you’re buying, you can always ask. If you open up your dac (or a clear picture of insides) you will either see transistors, indicating discrete, somewhere near the audio outs or you will see only chip op amps. As for linear power supply, for that you need to see a transformer. And it will be heavy. I have personally found that long-term enjoyment of a component (as distinct from quick reviews) correlates with quality components inside. |