It is not a question of intent it is a question of sensitivity.
Do posters intend to hurt the feelings of other members?
It is usually the case that members engage in spirited, often passionate, discussions in threads. That’s normal. Regrettably, often those discussions veer off the tracks, where members are offended or genuinely have their feelings hurt by the content of others’ post(s).
Do posters intend to hurt the feelings of other members? Your thoughts?
Do posters intend to hurt the feelings of other members? Your thoughts?
131 responses Add your response
@elizabeth : "Let alone the ones now well into the thousands of replies (usually by the same few people)." I think the exception to this is the threads that simply discuss what someone happens to be listening to at the moment. Nothing deep. Nothing technical. Little or no snarking or incivility. But, a treasure for those of us looking for new music, especially rock music which is now practically counterculture. |
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You know what's interesting is to pick on a forum category - say, "Speakers" - and then go back to the VERY first postings there (in "Speakers", they're from 1999) and see how the language, engagement, syntax, and civility has changed in the last 20 years. In some cases the changes are palpable. In others, you can see echoes of the snarking and ankle-biting so prevalent today. |
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I'll go one deeper. I remember something that Dietrich Bonhoeffer (one of my absolute heroes) said: "Where [the] discipline of the tongue is practiced right from the beginning, each individual will make a matchless discovery. He will be able to cease from constantly scrutinizing the other person, judging him, condemning him, putting him in his particular place where he can gain ascendancy over him and thus doing violence to him as a person." I rarely have that discipline of the tongue (keyboard). |
elizabeth said: "I’m reporting you, celander for saying "Folks will report anything". " I’m reporting elizabeth for accusing celander of saying "Folks will report anything". I find the word "folks" to be very offensive. Calling people "folks" is a microaggression and is on the top 100 list of words waiting to get on the official list of trigger words. And if things couldn’t get any worse Google Chrome recognized the word "microaggression". Which to me is a microaggression. |
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T.ramey. For sure you can copy and paste a complete post. But here is the crazy part. Maybe somebody only saw your copied/ pasted post and took exception to it and reported it but did not bother to report the original post. Hence your post got deleted but the original stayed. It really does not matter the content of a post,if nobody reports it, highly unlikely it would be deleted as mods do not trawl through threads without a very good reason. As I have said I believe just the action of a post being reported can spell its end if the mod in question does not take the time to fully read the post, the thread and it's entire import and content. Which is highly unlikely to ever happen. |
@oregonpapa : Almost every post I have had removed on Audiogon was meant to be and obviously was meant in good natured humor. I know that is tough for a moderator, especially if they don’t have the time to know various members or research the context of a post they are considering deleting. But then you run into the issue of deleting posts that shouldn’t be while any number of mean spirited posts go untouched. I actually got a kick out of one of mine that was deleted. It was a Monty Python quote in reply to another Monty Python quote: "Yes, well, that’s the kind of blinkered Philistine pig ignorance I’ve come to expect from you non-creative garbage." I think it is funny because who, other than John Cleese, would say something like that these days? |
There are all sorts of motives for people to debate . . . but in my estimation, you cannot be insulted or hurt unless you allow it. If your self-esteem is so fragile that you take another person's tongue personally, then you will be at their mercy all through your life. Everyone has an opinion and everyone wants to be considered influential; unfortunately, there are those who can only do so by bullying, intimidation, and personality assault-- some even physical assault if nothing else will work. Of course, when defamation of character or physical assault happens, that is another matter and proper actions should be taken . . . but in the long-term, pick your battles for battles do not win the war, but the long-term strategy does. |
First, I want to say what a pleasure it is to read teo_audio's posts. A very clever guy, indeed. Next, when it comes to having your post removed, sometimes it's just out of spite and not for violating any rules. I've had a post removed that was more clever and direct than the one aimed at me and the offender took issue and had it removed. All it took was for me to contact Admin and asked for them to review it and they agreed that it was perfectly fine and they reinstated it. One has to remember that a lot of deletions are done on the fly as Admin can be quite busy. All the best, Nonoise |
Teo. It is quite possibly not the fault of overly aggressive mods. I have noticed at times, usually weekends, it will only take a post to be reported and it can be gone. Mods do not always completely read a post but just react to the reporting of it and poof!. I could be wrong and maybe a Mod would correct me. I have seen numerous very good posts deleted when there was nothing in them that fit the guidelines for removal at all. But it’s a free forum so not much you can do about it. |
THIRD TRY in dealing with overly aggressive moderators/posters. I strongly suspect it is one given poster who does not like me and wants my posts gone. Some aspect of their issues rising to kill the post: @djohnson54 well, that was not my intention. Just going with what the discourse here was leading and dovetailing a discussion on the very same language I had with my son that morning driving to practice when he used it (yet again) after I asked him to not accept that language from his 3rd grader pals as his own. This happens because our early learning notably contains much in the way of taking on via observance and adopting things as our own. So not really early learning but taking on things without thought. This is due to the number of things required to become a human bipedal, are too complex and too numerous ---for an immature intellect to contemplate. Observe, repeat, adopt/take on..but no analysis. Intellect is about bypassing this natural function as one arises into being the physical adult. Or not --- depending on the given nature of wiring and how one was raised. It is the origin of Aristotle’s statement, “Give me a child until he is 7 and I will show you the man.” Gotta love those various schools and the control over children that is handed over.... Intellect, in the final form (adult) or earlier forms (juvenile-child), was not meant to and cannot operate at full tilt all the time...as this is too slow and too energy consuming glucose wise and whatnot. So the brain is like the muscles of the body, designed for temporary full runs and then to stop. You can feel it happen in moments of inspiration..and you are firing on all the cylinders you were given... and then cylinders additionally developed (the brain is elastic and learns/unlearns) ...and then....you can feel it fade, past a certain point of peak contemplation/understanding. It cannot be held. But the size of it, the scope of if it, the run of it and the low mode size and power..can all be changed, via working it. This generally requires health as well, as the body is the carrier. (see: esoteric schools and systems) We were designed to encounter a problem, to ruminate, find the first solution and then the brain is to go back to sleep and low power mode. Eureka! And then brain fade. By design. To go back to rote repetition and hindbrain aspects of emotional rule of thought process. Additionally, emotions rule and control and filter all rumination. First filter. Survival, procreation. Fear and desire are the bottom most filters that all thoughts cannot escape being formed by,and depending on the threat assessment by the body, the filter is either more or less aggressive in considering all rumination and shaping of rumination. In essence, all here use their ass first and foremost ....and filter via it, in all things, to some dialed in level of potency in the given moment. By design. The monkey perseveres, first and foremost. No body, no carrier, no mind, no ’life’. Monkey first in all things. That’s why there are 7+ billion of us, in one state or another of tearing the planet apart, as the monkey cannot yet be shut off or shunted enough for an unfiltered non rose colored glasses version of intellect to arise or be. The esoteric schools and tomes, teaching and learning.. are all about addressing this fundamental problem of perception and self. A major portion of them are, anyway... They are all about clearing this issue up, for the intrepid who want to look beyond the monkey into an actual intellectual analysis of the nature of reality. Hint, the nature of reality is not 3-d timespace ground pounder Newtonian stuff. Also, that intellect can be made to be greater than it is, if the starting point is is good enough to take it to new heights. The path is all pain, for the most part, but it does indeed work. Monkey and ego gets no free ride - in fact, the opposite. The modern western world, is run and controlled out of via and through the filter of your balls. This is purposeful as it rings in and completes a circle of control. Money is essentially an animal control mechanism, paraded about as being outside of emotions and problems. The west as a fenced and boxed commodity. By design. Very Straussian. With walls far enough away that most of the denizens insist they are free. Good job. Nicely done. As for the on-line communication thing, when you look at it with this corrected vantage point, you see that all the cues we use in in person contacts, are missing in the on line discourse. Even the words themselves are spoken inside our own heads, via the ego loop mechanism. The end point of that long trail of data and discourse, is that our on-line statements are more a reflection of us than they are of the person we respond to. That the 90% of the data we miss when reading other’s words in our heads... that we fill that in from who we are and how we use those words and arrangements of words. So our flung refuse >>>>is all mirror<<<<. Which leads to the very funny thing said to me once, about all that, is where you sometimes have to ask the given poster who is all full of vitriol and nastiness, to ask if they wanted a peanut for their monkey... This is principally about western music which is about the monkey and his/her unconscious hindbrain as forebrain.... caught in a hiccuped emotional/ego feedback loop. It’s pleasure as sound as connected to motion and feelings, in a looped beat pattern system. Western music, essentially. (that you can feed a nearly newborn music and they will..move) So we try to talk logic and thinking on a balls forum, full of people here in the act of pursing that to as much perfection and completeness as they can, at any price. And how well is that going to turn out? |
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One of the first threads I read here was "no-one-actually-knows-how-to-lculate-what-speaker-cable-they-need" The way the author was treated there was inexcusably rude, whether you agreed with the author or not. It put me off. I never could figure why the person who started the thread tolerated such nonsense or the moderators for that matter. I’m curious, and am asking, what any moderator's thoughts are on the subject of this thread. I feel somebody should be looking after contributors and posters being offended by someone who is anonymous to them, behind a keyboard somewhere. What do you think? Mike |
viridian ... Naw, some of the most enjoyable posters (at least to me) have that dry sense of humor you speak of. Part of the fun of this site is the humor. Sometimes I think I'm visiting the Comedy Store in Hollywood. Stand-up comedians like Geoff, et al are sometimes snarky but funny at the same time. Also, there are some very creative folks here at A'gon who really have a way with words ... skilled essayists, if you will. I love reading those responses. What I object to are the vicious personal attacks. Geeze, I've been called a snake oil salesman, a shill, a conman and more, all because I have expressed enthusiasm over various products. This has happened in threads I've either started or contributed to regarding ... Audio Research products, room treatments, fuses, tweaks ... and on and on. I've even been compared recently to a phony evangelist faith healer by one sick poster. Hell, if that were true, I'd lay hands of the guy's post and heal his negativity in order to improve his darkened, narrow little life. These guys, the ones who are hell-bent on destroying the joy, and/or successes of others, are sick individuals who need help. As the great Zig Ziglar said ... "They need a checkup from the neck up." "They suffer from stinkin' thinkin'." :-) Frank |
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It does seem as if some posters are just waiting to pounce on others with ideas and thoughts/experiences that are not inline with their own.I think some of these folks would have been classified as "Phone Bad Asses" back in the day.You know,Chuck Norris/Bruce Lee on the phone..Mr Rogers face to face. |
I know exactly what you mean.I've responded to threads asking for opinions/experience with one component or another and have the op get upset and defensive if my experience differed from his.I never criticize people for having different tastes.Just stating I liked/disliked something and why/why not is not a personal attack! |
What I really have a hard time with is when you give an opinion on one thing or another, just so happens to be HiFi here,, lets say I express my feelings about brand A, and why I dont like its design , its only an opinion. Thats it , just one jackasses (me) perception of a thing. To me this is so insignificant, its just passing time.. Maybe if someone is cool we can engage in intellectual debate for fun, lets see who can think well on thier rfeet. .. Nonetheless opinions are meaningless for our purposes in speaking of audio. There are people that will actually be offended by someone elses perception of a thing. Somehow they take someone elses perception personally. Talk about seeking discomfort. Its just weird to me. anyone understand this at all ? |
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Just to clarify I guess. I have no intention of ever entering a thread with intent to " hurt anybodies feelings". But..... If somebody ends up getting upset maybe because not all that was stated was correct well that's unfortunate but it is what it is. I will pull no punches no matter who it is and expect exactly the same in return. Sometimes the truth hurts...... |
